[WalterBright]

> frankly I don't see any argument for less than proportional representation that isn't predicated on the notion that some people are more equal than others

Consider two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. That's why the Senate exists.

[unlinked_dll]

Good thing we're not sheep or wolves. That's why I alluded to Orwell. The pigs from Animal Farm are a better metaphor.

The senate doesn't exist to protect the will of sheep at the hands of wolves. It exists because 250 years ago, the edit: New Jersey delegation wasn't willing to relinquish its equal power at the Constitutional Convention to a state like Virginia. Its never been about sheep and wolves, it's been about the political power of a political class that sought to concentrate as much of it as possible for themselves at the expense of others.

If you want a better way to look at it, it's a dozen wolves convincing a dozen sheep that the wolves should have twice the voting power on dinner because they have a bigger grazing area.

[WalterBright]

> concentrate as much of it as possible for themselves at the expense of others

I.e. sheep and wolves.

[threatofrain]

How does the senate stop the strong from trampling the weak? Who are the strong and who are the weak? Are African Americans weak? Are poor people weak? How do the delineations of state lines interact or align with boundaries of power?

If there's a proposal that Nevada should be the nuclear dump site of the nation, how would the structure of the house or senate stop that kind of thing? What if Nevada is just a trading item between two powerful parties? What does the constitution even say about this?

Now we are seeing a situation where California flexes its economic capacity during an international emergency. What are other states supposed to do in light of that? It's either a central force steps in to stop logistical contest based on morally and strategically questionable context (which state has more money), or...? What about the structure of congress speaks to this?

What Gavin Newsom is implying here, IMO, is that there's responsibility (and thus power) being left on the table. Due to this vacuum, even Jeff Bezos or Jack Ma could step in. What about the structure of congress speaks to this?

[WalterBright]

> Who are the strong and who are the weak?

The states with more population have more votes in the House, meaning they are the strong. The Senate stops Florida and California from eating Rhode Island for dinner.

It's not more complicated than that.

[threatofrain]

> If there's a proposal that Nevada should be the nuclear dump site of the nation, how would the structure of the house or senate stop that kind of thing? What if Nevada is just a trading item between two powerful parties? What does the constitution even say about this?

> What Gavin Newsom is implying here, IMO, is that there's responsibility (and thus power) being left on the table. Due to this vacuum, even Jeff Bezos or Jack Ma could step in. What about the structure of congress speaks to this?

And how do the delineations of American states align to the delineations of the most salient lines of power in the US, such as money? How does it provide balance?

[WalterBright]

> how would the structure of the house or senate stop that kind of thing?

All states have equal power in the Senate regardless of their population size.

[threatofrain]

I just talked about a scenario where the negotiation is between two parties and the proposal is a national site for nuclear waste in Nevada. And that's not a very nationally energizing issue, so that wouldn't even be a very interesting priority to be traded on.

I then talked about a scenario where during an international emergency its money that talks, even Jack Ma's money. What does having equal senate votes matter here?

We seem to be safeguarding some old boundary that fails to negotiate with the real lines of power. Party and Money.

[lonelappde]

The Senate exists to preserve slavery and other interests of the colonial aristocracy. This is basic history.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas%E2%80%93Nebraska_Act