[H8crilA]

Amazon is truly exceptional, do not make a rule out of it. Bezos is kinda like Buffett, in their own league of master capital allocators. For example, Amazon got a lot of financial leverage on the "float" between credit card payments and sending the money to merchants. Again, kind of similar to Berkshire which is leveraged on the insurance "float".

Also, heavy CAPEX or any other form of internal reinvestment does not mean there should be no profits. Look at Google, Facebook, Apple, Microsoft - all those companies were bootsrapped mostly through internal cash flow. All of those companies were profitable when IPOing (just look at historic S-1s).

[ksdale]

Heavy CAPEX doesn't require no profits, but it can easily result in that.

[H8crilA]

If, over the long term, CAPEX spendings do not produce profits, it means that the purchased assets did not produce enough payoff to compensate for their depreciation charges. You could argue with the accounting depreciation rules (i.e. how much needs to be written off per year, i.e. you think the asset is longer lived than the accounting rules say), but the general idea stands - it is a sign of bad capital allocation.

[ksdale]

If the profits from the CAPEX just get plowed into more CAPEX, though, you could end up looking like you don't have profits for decades, and it isn't necessarily a problem as long as you're growing.

Edit: What I'm saying is that profit is a lagging indicator of CAPEX, and your lack of profit now could be the result of bad CAPEX 5 years ago, or good CAPEX 5 years ago, plus aggressive new CAPEX now.

[H8crilA]

I think you don't know what "profits" are, i.e. don't know accounting.

CAPEX is written down via depreciation charges over many years. I.e. if you buy something for $1M, and it has an accounting life of 10 years, you book $100k losses per year.

What you're thinking about is called "cash flow", not "profits".

[ksdale]

Is this not basically what Amazon did? Massive capital expenditures with cascading depreciation that wiped out profits while increasing cash flow until they got to a certain size and decreased CAPEX and recognized profits?

[otoburb]

>>If, over the long term, CAPEX spendings do not produce profits, it means that the purchased assets did not produce enough payoff to compensate for their depreciation charges.

Even if CAPEX generates profits, if the returns were lower than your capital cost then company would have been better off not investing and returning that instead to shareholders.

[H8crilA]

Yes, that's the 101 of being a capital allocator, like a CEO or a CFO. Only invest into anything if the returns exceed your cost of capital.

Presentation on this very topic: https://youtu.be/c20_S-QgvsA?t=730

[gowld]

Shareholders would be better off, not company better off. Wage earners in the company got paid.