[paulmd]

While I suppose it’s an interesting academic discussion, frankly the idea of being able to safely contain an aerosolized upper respiratory disease at home is ludicrous to begin with, so it doesn’t really matter.

The simple truth of the matter is that if you are in a home or apartment with an infected person, and you remain present during their period of high viral shedding, you’re practically certain to contract it as well. You don’t have a negative pressure containment room, your home furnace is going to drag it all over the house. Normal airflow as you open the door will probably drag it out.

It’s perfectly valid to stay and care for grandpa, just don’t have any illusions that you’re not going to get it as well. You 100% will. Doctors who are trained in cleanliness and with access to real, non-makeshift gear are getting it.

That’s fine if you’re not a senior yourself. Severe reactions are fairly rare for anyone under 60 or so. And it can’t really be helped without abandoning grandpa.

[doodlebugging]

I am going to use recent personal experience to disagree with your conclusion that uninfected people in a house with someone who is infected cannot protect themselves and will end up sick.

This past December, in the week before Christmas, my wife had surgery that required an overnight stay. She was released with instructions to avoid laughing, coughing, no physical activity, etc. for several weeks. A couple days after she was home our son came down with an infection that turned into a deep, dry, raspy cough with sudden fever over 102*F. Since she needed to avoid any sort of infection and he was getting worse by the hour I took him to ER where he had a test for flu since people at his school had been down with it in the weeks prior.

The ER doctor told us it was a viral infection but the flu test was negative meaning that we either got there before there was enough viral material for a positive test or that it was something else causing it besides flu.

It became my job to keep his infection from spreading to my wife. To manage that I used sanitation instructions from my sister, a nurse, and I kept him isolated in his bedroom and my wife in our bedroom. I prepared all meals, etc. and cleaned the house, etc. I slept in a spare bedroom in case I was infected. I bought some cheap face masks, not hospital grade, just over-the-ear masks and made sure that she wore one every time she left her room and he wore one every time he left his room. I also wore one every time he left his room. Once he returned to his room I went along behind him and wiped every knob, switch, flat surface, etc that he could've contacted and put his used glasses and utensils in the dishwasher. Then I washed my own hands.

My son's fever broke after 4 days on Motrin and his cough went away too.

My wife never got sick and neither did I. We were all in the same house sharing the same air on days when the heater ran regularly due to a strong cold front.

No one wore a mask all the time. We wore them only when we had the opportunity to have contact with each other.

When the stories started breaking in China about this, I started following it all here on HN. I understood the challenges they would face having just faced similar challenges myself.

I found myself with part of a container of lysol wipes, a few cheap face masks that hadn't been used, some hand sanitizer for each bedroom, and the knowledge that one could beat something like this if they were diligent.

I realize that this is just my story but it is all true. Isolating the infected person, using PPE, sanitizing everything diligently can prevent everyone in the house from being infected if someone in your family does come down with an airborne infection.

My house is cluttered and disinfecting was potentially a chore but I made it easier by following each person along and watching carefully everything that they did while they were out "in public". Once they were isolated, I retraced their steps wiping everything down. I hope you don't have to share my experience but you can rest easier knowing that there is hope.

[aaavl2821]

All of the things you've said about mask functionality, reusability and sterilization are very interesting. As is your experience with in-home caregiving.

Is there a quick, effective and easy sanitizing protocol for N95 masks that you think would work for hospitals that are short on masks?

[doodlebugging]

One of the first articles that I read mentioned the use of autoclaves, essentially steamers used for sterilizing surgical tools, etc. I think it was a NIOSH article. These are already in use in hospitals.

That led me to the article I linked about using microwaves. Microwave ovens excite water molecules to cook and the creation of steam from the cooking process should kill the pathogens.

I have family members who need some protection from this threat and that is why I went down this rabbit hole in the first place.

Based on everything I read I am comfortable concluding that masks can be reused if they are sanitized by microwaving with a small amount of water to create steam.

The methods tested in the paper appear to show effectiveness that maintains N95 rating and kills pathogens in the process.

I am not a doctor and in fact I spend too much of my time trying to avoid ever seeing one.

Perhaps you or someone else out there can recreate these tests or conduct similar tests to determine whether this is viable.

[mattkrause]

An autoclave is more like a pressure cooker than a steamer.

You need temperatures well in excess of 100 degrees Celsius to reliably kill everything, especially bacterial spores (which, admittedly, are not the major issue here).

To do so, autoclave use high pressure steam (121C at 15 psi) for long enough that everything reaches that temperature. A microwave won’t even get close to that, though it can disinfect, rather the sterilize, just like boiling water can. You also need to be careful that the entire object gets heat-treated; home microwaves often have hot and cold spots and one missed spot can spoil everything.

This stuff is fairly complicated and I’d encourage you stick with established methods if you can, which I think is currently treatment with a UVC lamp.

[doodlebugging]

Thanks for the information. I agree that home microwaves heat unevenly but I think that is one of the reasons that the authors in the article went with bagging the masks. The steam would be trapped in the bags and the masks would get treatment at a more consistent temperature making the process more effective at killing the pathogens.

I think that microwaving the masks accomplishes the task using tools that an ordinary person may already have on hand and tools which require almost no training. UV sterilization is complicated by the need to avoid exposure to UV light and the fact that most people don't have a suitable UV lamp available. Hospitals may already have those tools on hand and in that case they probably have trained users who can disinfect masks with them. That seems to be the best way for them to reuse masks.