[virtualwhys]

Having witnessed at least 100 sessions, there are no long-term changes beyond the participant having intimately experienced some aspect of the infinite (whether it be harrowing or blissful) and as a result knowing that that potentiality exists.

Behaviorally most just go back to the same patterns and aren't particularly changed. Ayahuasca, due to the before/after dietary constraints, is more effective (IMO) in inducing lifestyle changes.

That said, 5MeO is the death experience (i.e. it very likely mirrors the experience at the moment of physical death) and is, if nothing else, great practice for the real thing :)

In terms of adverse effects, some wounded warriors take days, weeks, or even months to heal, but that's the same for any psychedelic, a segment of the population will be adversely affected.

Also, 5MeO can be abused; I've encountered at least one facilitator who takes it daily (over 3K journeys), which seems somewhat excessive, and can be seen in their flat affect (i.e. you'd expect such a being to radiate joy if number of journeys === depth of experience).

[collyw]

> Behaviorally most just go back to the same patterns and aren't particularly changed.

From what i read of the Johns Hopkins studies using psychedelics to quit smoking, CBT style sessions before the psychedelics was a key part of the program.

[Albedoen]

Is preparation & integration part of the 100 sessions you have witnessed?

I agree that without the proper context & assistance, most of the effect is just wasted and remains in people's Being as a distant experience.

[virtualwhys]

There is no preparation for 5MeO per se, as no amount of meditation, yoga, mantra practice, etc. can save you during the experience, but certainly abstaining from alcohol, eating a vegetarian diet, avoiding conflict in the days leading up to the ceremony, and so on, are recommended by the facilitator.

As far as integration goes, I mean, who really knows the territory of the infinite such that they can help another through some difficulty in their own unique path? Most facilitators that I've seen just collect the rather large cash based consulting fee and move on to the next group, with a hug or pat on the back if a participant had a difficult journey.

I'm certainly skeptical when there's an undeniable profit motive involved, so the whole facilitator role is a bit overblown; there's no shamanic tradition behind Bufo (discovered in the 80s), it's just people that have had experience with the substance serving it to others, hopefully with good intentions.

[Albedoen]

Yes, I resonate with what you share. The lack of integration. People taking fees to just hand you a pipe without support. Not everyone is like that however.

I also agree that nothing can prepare for the non-duality - but preparation can help you make the most of the experience & retain what was meaningful to you.

You'd be surprised how far we've come in terms of knowledge. We do have the practical models to navigate the dual experience having had the non-dual experience. Understanding that you are the embodiment of the Infinite through your direct experience isn't an end in itself. It is a beginning.

I have developed "business models of Being" for a lack of better terms that frames how to operate in an optimal fashion in the practical world of service.

[wsy]

Even without psychedelics, persons suffering from psychological issues can have breakdowns in therapeutic sessions. Professional therapists are very careful to not unlock 'dangerous' memories and insights prematurely, they wait until they consider the patient ready to deal with it. They also have emergency plans in place, reaching so far as taking care that an overwhelmed patient is afterwards treated in a hospital for a while to safely recover. Do you have such emergency plans in place?

While I trust that you can give psychologically healthy people a good experience, I have a hard time imagining how you could give the necessary support to people with larger issues. And because those issues are often deeply hidden, it is hard even for professionals to detect that in advance.

[Albedoen]

Excellent question - and yes some (all?) issues can't be detected in advance. I have a screening process before people get in the program. I mainly vet their intentions. If they have the right intention, I can trust them. Then in the preparation phase, I have a THOROUGH questionnaire about their physical, emotional and mental health, giving me a good picture of what I could face. But NOTHING can ever prepare me (besides my own experience) or the participant for what's to come. Entering the world of 5-MeO-DMT is opening Pandora's box. You never know what will come out. But in the session, it all comes down to how well I can hold space, how well there is trust between the participant and me (hence a one month preparation process) and how well we both can conduct what is being released. I also use EFT (emotions freedom techniques) to alleviate emotionally charged patterns & beliefs - BEFORE & AFTER sessions.

It is an intense journey but if you come with the right intention (heal, grow etc - & an attitude of humility & surrender), then there are tools to support you and in my experience, it all comes out alright.