[thompo]

'I'm sure you're up there with those who think that people who owe large sums of money should "just work harder" or "lay off alcohol and cigs".'

You say I'm "up there" like I'm some sort of snooty asshole for working my face off for six months to pay off my debt. I have my vices (I love you, Mary Jane) and I still managed to afford them so make whatever assumptions you will about me, I just found it more gratifying to work on my debt rather than get canned every weekend (not at first, it took a few months to get to that point).

I feel for you in regards to your injury, but 20k is pretty damn far from insurmountable debt. If anything it sounds like you've given up on yourself, and that sucks because I've been there and it's a tough spot to break out of.

I worked my ass off for six months to pay off 5k - work your ass off for 24 months and you'll be well on your way to knocking down that 20k.

Oh.... and just work harder.

[rick888]

I was 25K in credit card debt when I got out of school. I moved back in with my parents and pretty much didn't do anything outside of working and sleeping for a year, and paid it off I am still debt free (this was 5 years ago).

It takes self control and discipline, which most people don't have.

[Cadsby]

It's easy to be judgmental. What would you have done if you didn't have parents to mooch off of for a year? What if you had a family to support?

It's easy to tell yourself you succeeded all due to "self control" and "discipline". But the truth is like many judgmental types, you had considerable practical/emotional support as well.

[jerf]

"What would you have done if you didn't have parents to mooch off of for a year? What if you had a family to support?"

What if a cow comes stomping into your front room and demands that you feed her shredded hundred dollar bills until she's full enough to tap dance her way to victory in the upcoming school competition?

Hypothetical aren't arguments, they're just anchorless questions. You have to look around yourself, figure out what to do, and do it. It may take extreme measures and you may encounter setbacks, but you can't let hypotheticals stop you. What do you have, right now? You don't have to worry about the hypothetical things happening to other people. How can you leverage it? Can you move somewhere that has more stuff? Do you need to declare bankruptcy? Do you need to find a private charity to help you out? Sometimes drastic action is called for.

Very few of us are handed life on a silver platter, and a goodly number of those people get the silver platter yanked at some time during their life. We all got problems. Solve them to the best of your abilities, or don't. I'm not guaranteeing success, because nobody's guaranteed success, but if you just give up on self control and discipline you're guaranteeing failure.

[Cadsby]

The difference is my hypothetical is a realistic one many people face. Yours is just pure fantasy with no connection to reality.

Yes personal motivation and attitude to succeed are large factors, ones we should encourage, but the empirical evidence heavily suggest your personal circumstances and level of support are equally as important, if not more so.

I'm a little tired of people with multiple advantges largely ignoring them in favor of the "I'm so great and awesome and all you need to do is be like me" mentality.

[rick888]

"It's easy to be judgmental. What would you have done if you didn't have parents to mooch off of for a year? What if you had a family to support?"

The thing is, If I have a family, it means I'm already making enough to support them. This is the self-control and discipline I was talking about. Too many people decide to have kids and don't do anything to prepare (IE: save money, etc).

If I didn't have family, I would still be fine. I would have gotten a cheap apartment and paid it off in two years.

"But the truth is like many judgmental types, you had considerable practical/emotional support as well."

Really? I didn't know "judgmental types" and "practical/emotional support" went hand-in-hand.

This is why unsuccessful people stay unsuccessful. They pass good advice off as "judgmental".

[nostrademons]

ViolentAcres actually had a good post about this a couple years ago:

http://www.violentacres.com/archives/32/drastic-measures/

Part of the problem is that when you're in debt, you get stressed, and when you're stressed, you tend to get tunnel vision and not see all of the possible alternatives. But the alternatives are out there. There are immigrant families that come here with nothing, sleep on sacks of rice in the back room of their workplace. There's the approach in the story above of going homeless and showering in the gym. There's roommates. You can live out of your car, if you have one.

[lyms]

Or just declare bankruptcy.

[TheAmazingIdiot]

I could post a heck of a lot more about my life, but I dont need the pity.

I was laid off, and am receiving unemployment. I hate that, cause I do like working. I do have funds guaranteed to go back to school in the fall due to my injury. I do some IT consulting on the side, but business has been slow recently. Also unemployment is 11% in my area, with a glut of HS and university students chewing up what little this area offers.

I put out about 10-20 resumes a day to a 50 mile radius, and have only had back 4 legit replies, with 30 spammy-fake offers of selling insurance and other affiliate scams.

I will have garnishment applied to me, due to flat out not being able to pay when I do get a job. Fortunately, garnishment does not apply to unemployment in IN, only passed last July.

I am now applying as a volunteer to the local United Way to get more experience and as valuable sources for my resume.

So, yes. I am making something of it. But the situation sucks.