[igreulich]

I don't see where it is canceled. The closest thing I see to canceled, is postponed.

From the update: 'We will not activate user level product usage tracking on GitLab.com or GitLab self-managed before we address the feedback and re-evaluate our plan.'

That leaves a lot of wiggle room.

[epoch_100]

"Further, GitLab will commit to not implementing telemetry in our products that sends usage data to a third-party product analytics service."

That seems like a pretty solid indication that the plans are cancelled.

[itake]

That sounds like they are going to roll out a first-party service, which is better, but not great for the self-hosted deployments.

[musicale]

Telemetry still sucks. I don't want it, and it should never be opt-out.

[scrollaway]

You opt in to first party telemetry by using gitlab. It is impossible for you not to send data to gitlab when using gitlab.

Self-host it if you don't want it. I dunno what to tell you; at some point, the company does have to observe how people use their product, and they'll do so a lot more effectively by looking at how most people are using it, rather than … idk, send a survey or something. Not that they won't do the latter anyway, nothing prevents them from doing that, but it's a very different type of data.

I'm a privacy nut by the way, and nothing in that field pisses me off more than people who vocally shit on telemetry. "I hate you, you should just GUESS what I want rather than do real work to figure it out" sort of thing.

What is it about telemetry you don't like, exactly? And I do say "telemetry" in general, because you're saying it sucks in general. So no specific examples like Windows 10's abhorrently overreaching telemetry, privacy invasions that look at PII, etc.

Telemetry generally is things like "97% of users have visited the issue tracker. 66% of projects with an issue tracker enabled have at least 1 issue. new issue rate on public repositories climbs by 15% if the new issue button is orange instead of green. users spend 30% more time on the new issue page if there's a new issue template. issues with a template have a commit/mr associated with them at a 8% higher rate than issues with empty templates".

By choosing to die on this hill, you're taking both good-will and attention away from much more severe issues of telemetry abuse, such as "let's collect the precise geoloc of all our users in our gay dating app at 5 minute intervals, store it for 3 years and not care one ounce about security".

[hsiehwnb]

Self-hosting was going to have telemetry, which is simply a dealbreaker for many companies.

And it may still have it. I just don't trust GitLab's management anymore.

[account42]

> You opt in to first party telemetry by using gitlab. It is impossible for you not to send data to gitlab when using gitlab.

There is still a difference between sending actions you selected to the server and tracking where you move the mouse while on the page in your browser or other bs like that. One is required to implement the functionality, the other is not.

[scrollaway]

Telemetry doesn't necessarily mean tracking mouse movements.

[TheSwordsman]

Telemetry is necessary to be able to observe the system, and look for adverse impact. You should be more thoughtful to the people supporting the tools you use, because without telemetry they do a bad job keeping it working for you.

[TeMPOraL]

If anything, the deterioration of quality in most modern software is a proof that telemetry makes people do bad job at keeping software working for its users.

[scrollaway]

Saying "the deterioration of quality in most modern software" is such a cop-out. There's no universal agreement upon any "general" deterioration, and I'm not sure you're keeping track of the "deteriorating" software that has telemetry vs. the one that doesn't. I personally find that a lot of software I use daily does improve over time, especially web software.

You want a counter-example? Reddit has very little telemetry and quite famously barely looks at the data it does gather. You want to talk about deterioration, how's that for some severe rot.

[hsiehwnb]

No, it is not. We have been selling software for decades without telemetry and it worked just fine.

I am more than willing to help GitLab, but telemetry in a VCS is simply a red flag (even a legal impediment in many cases).

[SlowRobotAhead]

No 1/2 decent CEO, PR, Legal or any other department at work here would leave themselves without wiggle room.

I’ll reserve the pitchforks for if this comes up again.

[hanniabu]

Yup, and it's not that they plan to backtrack, it's to reserve room for not committing to an exact outcome, but instead a general outcome. What they plan to do is not necessarily what will happen exactly, as anybody that has been in a position of authority or part of a project knows. Things may take a little longer, there may be some detours, etc. It's insurance so somebody doesn't armchair nitpick and shame them.

[bigiain]

I think there's compelling evidence that there is not a "1/2 decent" CFO at work there...

I'm gonna keep my pitchfork sharp, close, and on display here.