[docker_up]

Impossible? Lol I have a handful of friends that do this. It's hard work but they make 5 to 6 figures consistently per year.

It's very very hard, and not everyone can do it. I tried and lost a lot of money. But it's definitely not impossible, that is simply a lie.

[glitchc]

Your friends are probably lying to you or themselves (or both) about the making money part. It's typical for gamblers to overstate their winnings and understate their losses in the long-haul to somehow convince themselves they're ahead when they're actually behind.

[docker_up]

They are lying because you've never made money daytrading? As per my other comment, this is absurd. Being a profitable daytrader is very hard, and it's not probable, but definitely possible.

[glitchc]

It's not a question of possibility, but a question of probability. Lots of things are possible with very tiny probabilities. That's why we do research, to estimate the probability of a phenomenon being true, in this case making money daytrading.

The research in the paper suggests that the probability that your friends are making more than a teller is 0.4%, therefore the probability that they are making less than a teller is 99.6%. So, if you have a hundred friends in daytrading, only one of them made more than minimum wage, two of them made money but at or below minimum wage, and ninety-seven of them lost money. Therefore, if they all told you they were making money, most (97%) of them were lying.

[marketgod]

Look at the 10-k filings of companies. Lot's of people beat the market and hedge funds in particular. The thing is it's a hard skill to attain. Day trading is probably not the best, but the study should have focused on Full-Time trading. If you trade reversal/swing it's definitely possible to beat the market.

Just this year, I am at 35% returns, however, September is not in my calculation and this month was probably the most profitable so I should be around 50% at the end of the month if not higher (and this is a bad year.) Also the market has been choppy lately, the last few months so harder to lock in gains.

[brk]

All things considered, "5 figures" seems like a pretty low income for something that is "very very hard", and risky. Seems like if you have the skills and tenacity to day trade like that you could find some other job to pay you high 5 figures with a more stability.

[docker_up]

$20,000 per year is livable in many areas of the US, especially if you have a lot of savings to back that up. The point is that saying it's "impossible" is a lie.

[brk]

Where is $20,000 ‘livable’? Savings or not, I don’t know of many places where you could live on a net income of ~$1,300/mo. what do you do for medical benefits alone in that income bracket?

[aphextim]

Upper Michigan:

If you have $20,000 you get MI Health plan, essentially free healthcare in the poor income bracket (for now anyway unless it gets taken away, sign up where you get food stamps).

Rent on a 2 bedroom apartment, as long as you are not in the "big" city of Marquette should be $400-$500.

Heck when I was younger we 'rented' an entire 5 bedroom house, two story with basement for $950 (split 4 ways with roommates).

Food and cost of living is cheap, especially if you go to farmers markets and buy stuff in season.

Winter can be tough as heating costs go up, however they do offer those 'locked' in plans where you pay more in summer month but less in winter as it averages out your price. Overall you always pay more this way, however if you have trouble managing money having a steady rate can be more beneficial.

If they took medical benefits away from low income bracket which I could see happening, well just hope you don't get sick, otherwise the rest is doable. As my dad once told me when I moved out at 18, as long as you got a roof over your head, and food in your stomach, the rest is details.

[rongenre]

Again - if you've got the talents to make $20k/yr day trading, you can do much better working remotely at far less risk. So higher sharpe ratio.

Also the UP is pretty much miserable.

[aphextim]

>Also the UP is pretty much miserable.

I feel that is subjective. I know many people in this area who live wonderful happy lives being self sufficient, living off the land and having a large community and frequent family gatherings. The area is beautiful if you like outdoor activities such as hiking, camping, fishing, bike trails and in the winter there is a lot of cross country skiing and snowmobiling. Worst thing here right now is the Opioid crises which sadly is happening in many rural areas across the nation.

I guess personally I would prefer the country life vs fast living in a big city, but again that's my opinion. Especially with the ability to work remote, and the ability to get things shipped up here via the internet it makes life easy.

Gone are the days of having to drive 3 hours for computer parts :)

[ben_w]

I make $10,000 per year while sitting on my backside and at almost zero risk. It’s called “collecting rent”, which is especially easy if you have a lot of savings.

[pembrook]

Sigh. Here's the truth, everybody knows a guy at work who claims they make money "day trading."

If you know more than 1 person who beats the market consistently by trading, you should open a fund-of-funds and start investing institutional money, ASAP. The Harvard endowment would love to speak with you.

[docker_up]

This is absurd. You don't know my friends, and you say they are lying?

Daytrading for a single account and managing a multi-billion dollar fund are completely different strategies and need completely different skillsets. You should educate yourself before talking authoritatively on subjects you don't know very much about.

[VeninVidiaVicii]

I mean... 10,000 is five figures.

[matwood]

> It's hard work but they make 5 to 6 figures consistently per year.

For how many years, and how much seed money did they start with? The problem with making a high percentage consistently is it requires taking on huge risks. Those huge risks mean at some point a trade will go bad and your friends will be done.

[ectospheno]

Your particular logical fallacy is "cherry picking".

[docker_up]

You only need one example to disprove that something is "impossible".

[lallysingh]

Not against "impossible."