[hutzlibu]

"If we want Brazil to remain as one country "

Why would we want that? "We" want the rainforest, habitat to so many wildlife, to remain intact, as undisturbed as possible. So if the protected rainforest is then part of brazil or a hypothetical WWF or greenpeace state doesn't really matter to me, as long as the rainforest remains protected.

And yes, the main problem seems to be the poverty of the local population. When you are poor and starving, you cannot really care about enviroment. But as far as I know, all the industrialscale rainforest cutting and soy farming did not really changed something about the poverty, or did it?

[Mirioron]

>Why would we want that?

Because Brazil wants Brazil to remain one country. That kind of a thing takes precedence over essentially any environmental issues for them. You can disregard it, but you will then not understand why Brazil won't play ball.

[hutzlibu]

So Brazil is a single mind then?

All the indigenous people want to be so much part of Brazil? (Or were ever asked, if they want to be part of it in the first place?)

I kind of doubt that.

So naivlely asking, why should the corrupt oligarchies in the cities, should have any rights about the rainforest in the first place, when all they care about is to squeeze as much money out of it as possible?

Because teritorial integrity is the sacred cow of modern politics and everybody too scared, what else might happen, if this dogma is to be questioned? Probably yes. So serious international pressure on brazil about really protecting the rainforest, is right now probably the way to go. (Which of course, does not exclude pressure on other sinners)

But it probably does not hurt, if people think about loudly about other consequences, of what might happen if the brazilian government continues to not give a damn, as there are really many supporters of the amazonas rainforest around the globe.

[Mirioron]

>Because teritorial integrity is the sacred cow of modern politics and everybody too scared, what else might happen, if this dogma is to be questioned?

Compromising another country's territorial integrity can very easily lead to a justified war.

[hutzlibu]

"Justice" is made up by people. For centuries is was justified to conquer and change borders by force. Then suddenly there was a stop ... but all the old borders made by force should remain. That might get questioned again on a broader base, if the borders on a land does not match up with what people think and feel what is right.

So again, why is the amazonian rainforest the property of the brazilian government? Did they plant it? Did they bought it from the people who used to live there? I don't think so. In the end, it comes down to power. Your government might be stronger than the natives living there, but like I said, more people care about the rainforest now, than the people who lived there.

[hu3]

> So again, why is the amazonian rainforest the property of the brazilian government? Did they plant it? Did they bought it from the people who used to live there? I don't think so.

They fought for and defended their territory just as other sovereign countries.

Quote from some levels above:

> Why do the natural oil reserves in Texas or Alaska belong to the US?

[hutzlibu]

Well, apparently there actually are wars for oil. And there are actually quite some people who would make war for the rainforest. But since environment is their motivation, they prefer different methods.