[adim86]

To be honest it really disturbs why people hate Tesla so much. Citing your reason for them being over-optimistic or over-promising, how else do people change the world? I don't mean this message as an attack but something to think about. These guys are working on something No one has EVER done in the history of mankind and we require them to stick to timetables and if they don't the punishment is we wish them failure and celebrate it? If Tesla is to succeed all our lives will be better for it, why are their mistakes and obstacles celebrated? Why do we care if the company is overvalued? This is the same sentiment towards Apple when the iPhone first came out till it no longer could be ignored. Tesla is far from a perfect company, but their mission is true and the real question we should be asking ourselves rather than if we like Elon, or if the company is overvalued or if they over promise and under deliver. the real question is, Is this company really trying to fulfill its mission statement, If yes, would we want such a mission to succeed?

[hyperbovine]

All that is great. I just wish they could do it without lying through their teeth. Elon is still claiming with a straight face that fully autonomous, L5 Teslas are coming next year. This is a lie. Everyone knows it is a lie. Why is this necessary? Couldn't he change the world without engaging in that sort of behavior?

[godelmachine]

Elon blatantly lies through his teeth on many occasions.

Somewhere around 2013, he claimed Tesla would launch a "fully autonomous, L5" in 2 years, but it would take another 3 years of regulatory approval. Clearly a gross misrepresentation of facts.

[ck425]

Lying is perhaps the wrong word here. Sharing self-delusion is probably a more accurate way of describing it. He genuinely believes many of his own exaggerations. But to be fair without a big dose of self delusion no one would be crazy enough to try these things in the first place.

I take his claims with a massive pinch of salt, while also appreciating that trait is somewhat necessary to solve the problems he's trying to solve.

[hyperbovine]

> He genuinely believes many of his own exaggerations.

Either a) he is lying, or b) the CEO of multiple companies worth a combined ~$100b is delusional to the point of being unable to recognize basic facts. Pick your poison.

[Faark]

He is CEO of those companies exactly because of his above average ability to make those delusions reality, no matter how impossible people considered e.g. landing rocket stages. I'd prefer him to project more of a visionary image with less harmful/psychotic aspects, but you can only get humans as a complete package and I'd have a hard time coming up with people to replace him.

[sneak]

Facebook’s active user growth is also a stark and plain lie; if Tesla succeeds, the world will improve. If Facebook succeeds, the world gets a lot worse.

It’s misplaced ire.

[clouddrover]

> if Tesla succeeds, the world will improve

It doesn't matter if Tesla succeeds or fails. All car companies now have to meet fleet emissions targets and the way they're going to do it is by building electric cars, either battery electric or fuel cell or both.

[Wiretrip]

"These guys are working on something No one has EVER done in the history of mankind" - erm people were making electric cars before ICE ones!