[notacoward]

> particularly religious fundamentalists and anarchist types.

You mean the significant majority of home schoolers, driving most of the agenda e.g. around certification and curriculum standards? Public schools are meant to ensure that every child can get a minimal level of education. Obviously it's great when people can do better, whether it's through regular public schools, charter schools, private schools, or home schooling. The problem is that when you open it up to just anyone without any kind of certification, testing, or oversight, it results in a form of neglect.

> it is only available to middle and upper class families

Sadly, no. That might describe the home schoolers you see, but "home schooling" which involves little or no actual schooling is also a common option for the (especially rural) poor. Some of my own first and second cousins grew up that way, and basically never recovered.

[burfog]

You don't have to be a religious fundamentalist of any type (Christian, Muslim, Jewish, etc.) to be deeply offended by the political indoctrination in the history and sex-ed classes. Atheists and agnostics are not of one mind on those subjects.

[notacoward]

I don't think that contradicts any of what I said. If people have a principled objection to public school, good for them. They should have the right to secure an equivalent education any other way they choose ... but it has to be equivalent. If not, too bad. Parents aren't allowed to feed their children sawdust instead of food, and they're not allowed to fill their their children's heads with religious/libertarian dogma instead of an actual education, for the same reason. Either would be a violation of the child's rights, and that's unacceptable in a civilized society.

[jriot]

Schools fill them with their own religious/political dogma. You just don't like it because it doesn't match your worldview.

[HNLurker2]

Couldn't agree more. Here in Romania it is illegal to not put your children in school and homeschooling is basically a crime.

Also religion was obligatory up until few years ago after they changed the law that made people do extra work if they want to study religion.

[burfog]

The whole point is to NOT be equivalent. That is the principled objection to public school. For example:

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=trump+history+school+book&t=canoni...

About half the population would be offended by those textbooks. You're insisting on an equivalent education, which would mean teaching with that same bias. The whole point is to do otherwise.

One can find other examples in the way books treat the Vietnam war, the North American aboriginal population, LGBT, premarital sex, the causes of the Great Depression, unions, nationalized health care, the electoral college, the second amendment, Justice Clarence Thomas, Justice Ruth Ginsburg, and so many other political topics. History and sex-ed classes are deeply tied to politics.

You say that parents should be "not allowed to provide their children's with religious/libertarian dogma instead of an actual education", but many parents take the view that schools today are doing exactly that.

[notacoward]

> You're insisting on an equivalent education, which would mean teaching with that same bias.

Please learn what "equivalent" means. Maybe get some help at your local public school. It doesn't mean "identical" with the same biases etc. It's entirely possible to define what would constitute an equivalent education even in a subject such as history (never mind neutral subjects such as math which you seem unwilling to talk about) without requiring the exact same interpretation. In fact, public schools try very hard to accommodate all manner of ideological biases, while home-schoolers are often very inimical to all beliefs except their own. By demonstrating that tendency, you make a good argument against unregulated home schooling.

[burfog]

You want to talk about math now? OK...

My coworker's wife was a math major. She volunteered to help at her child's public school. (kind of surprised that this is allowed, actually) The teacher gave a math problem, "BLANK - 9 = 9", accepting both 9 and 0 as the only valid answers. My coworker's wife tried to correct this, claiming that 18 should be the only valid answer. The teacher insisted that 18 was incorrect because they hadn't covered 2-digit math yet!!!

This is not any sort of impoverished school, nor is it rural or urban, nor is it significantly non-white or immigrant or anything of the sort. It is borderline wealthy. Statistically, you'd expect it to be nearly the best America has to offer.

Nobody should want an equivalent to that.

[rayiner]

My story. Our “science” teacher in sixth grade was trying to teach us how to convert between Celsius and Fahrenheit. She taught us: “the freezing point of water is 0C and 32F. So what is the boiling point?” She called on me, and I answered: “212F.” She says “no, 132F!” Class laughed. My ears burned and I mumbled something about getting it mixed up with the melting point of lead.

I’ve never been able to forget that one. Okay, so people make mistakes. But temperatures are like a basic fact of everyday life. Do you really think water boils at 30 degrees hotter than it gets in a hot day? And do you trust these same people to teach your kids about World War II, the Constitution, evolution, climate change, etc?

[thrower123]

What? That's a doozy. But I think most of us here have probably seen the same kind of thing. It's always fun when you realize that the person you are obligated to respect and are purportedly supposed to be learning from is dumber than a bag of hammers.

Most of them get nasty when they are proven incorrect as well.

[notacoward]

That seems like a pretty big topic jump, doesn't it?