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by erentz 2581 days ago
> Why would you fiddle with that and threaten making Hong Kong less desirable to foreigners?

Because China is not as naturally unified as it likes to make out and having an example of a previously free and democratic state that still wants to agitate for freedom within your borders is intolerable to an authoritarian regime that needs to maintain control everywhere.
1 comments
anthuman 2581 days ago
Previously free? Hong Kong was a colony of britain which ruled with an iron fist and disallowed voting or democracy in Hong Kong. Hong Kong was never free nor democratic until it became part of China. Lots of brits love to pretend they brought democracy everywhere, but they didn't. Hong kong became a "democracy" and "free" after the brits got kicked out. The brits never let their colonies become democracies because britain was never really a democracy. Britain is a constitutional monarchy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitutional_monarchy

Also, the fact that china is an authoritarian communist state shows that they aren't pretending to be "naturally unified". If they were "naturally unified", they wouldn't be so authoritarian in the first place.

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spacehunt 2581 days ago
There were Legislative Council and District/Urban/Regional Council Elections even before the Joint Declaration was signed. In fact, in the final years of British administration both the LegCo and the Urban/Regional Councils were elected by universal suffrage.

Also,

> ... documents recently released by the National Archives in Britain suggest that beginning in the 1950s, the colonial governors who ran Hong Kong repeatedly sought to introduce popular elections but abandoned those efforts in the face of pressure by Communist Party leaders in Beijing.

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/28/world/asia/china-began-pu...

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anthuman 2581 days ago
Wasn't the "legislative" council filled with appointees and served as an advisory role to the british governor ruling over hong kong? Where is the democracy there. Also china played around with "local" elections, doesn't mean they were/are a democracy.

As for your last point, so what? Nobody is claiming china is a democracy. But neither was britain. And it's laughable that "chinese pressure" is why britain didn't allow democracy in hong kong. It's a convenient excuse that doesn't change the facts.

Britain never allowed democracy in hong kong. And it's simply absurd to claim hong kong was "free" when it was a conquered colony of britain. It's one of the ironies of history. Hong kong only became "free" and "democratic" under chinese rule.

And in the final years, the "LegCo and the Urban/Regional Councils" may have been elected but they were powerless advisors. The ruler of hong kong, the governor, who had actual power was not elected.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Patten

Does that guy look like an "elected" and "rightful" leader of hong kong? A guy who wasn't born in hong kong and who didn't grow up in hong kong ruled hong kong by appointment, not election. It's absurd that anyone would claim hong kong was free or democratic at any point under british rule. Britain itself wasn't a democracy and it never allowed any of it's colonies, especially the non-white colonies, to become a democracy.

The truth of the matter is hong kong was never a democracy and probably will never be one. Neither the colonizing brits or the chinese were interested in hong kong being a democracy.

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spacehunt 2581 days ago
Of course Hong Kong is supposed to be better under Chinese rule; it's no longer a colony!

I always find it amusing when people try to compare the PRC with the oppressive colonial empires as if they're on the same level...

As for whether LegCo was powerless, look up the Protection of the Harbour Ordinance. It was a bill introduced not by the government but by an elected legislator, something that will never happen under the current system. That bill has been the bane of the government ever since, even after the handover.

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wbl 2581 days ago
Hong Kong democracy was opposed by China. Look at the 68 riots.
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paulorlando 2581 days ago
Your point that Hong Kong democracy was opposed by China is a piece of history that few know. Britain wanted to introduce self-governance in the 1950s/60s but China deemed that to be a hostile act. Details: https://qz.com/279013/the-secret-history-of-hong-kongs-still...
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anoncake 2581 days ago
> Britain itself wasn't a democracy and it never allowed any of it's colonies, especially the non-white colonies, to become a democracy.

Britain does have its deficits, but by 1997 it certainly qualified as democratic by the usual standards. So do multiple of its former colonies.

> Hong kong only became "free" and "democratic" under chinese rule.

Under the rule of the PRC? Do you really believe that?

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