[RustyRussell]

> (1) the lightning network has been repeatedly attacked as unworkable trash

[ Disclosure: I work on the lightning specification and one of the implementations ]

I'm sure it has been attacked (because "cryptos, bro"), I'm disappointed that it made you dismiss it.

FWIW, I switched from Linux Kernel development to developing Lightning after almost 20 years: I find it ambitious, high-potential and fascinating, as well as challenging.

[drawnwren]

I don't mean to attack you. It's just that there is a large gap between well-engineered and easy to use.

I am 100% certain you're a better developer than I, and that lightning is not a result of poor engineering. But if a layman can't pick it up and use it in under 5 minutes, it's unworkable (if you're targeting laymen).

Crypto is full of genius engineers, and product folks, but I think there is (and always has been) a usability crisis.

Thanks for your work on both Linux and Lightning. I look forward to the day you can point to this comment on HN as being ridiculously dated.

[arshbot]

> I am 100% certain you're a better developer than I, and that lightning is not a result of poor engineering. But if a layman can't pick it up and use it in under 5 minutes, it's unworkable (if you're targeting laymen).

In this scenario linux is unworkable since a cli is probably too much for a layman. But that's why people built gnome and other window managers on top of the "unworkable" but useful core.

All we have to do is wait for some people to build that nice pretty layer on top - but the core must be an efficient tool

[drawnwren]

Yeah, I would say linux _is_ unworkable for laymen. If crypto were trying to sell itself as infrastructure, I would agree with your statement. But 'just wait for the nice pretty layer' is what people have been saying about btc for the last 10 years.