[mft_]

Interesting (and great that the bigger manufacturers are starting to come through with their electric offerings) but the price:range ratio doesn't seem great compared to the Tesla model 3?

It's hard to be objective with all of the strongly pro- and anti-Tesla nonsense flying around, but I've had a sneaking suspicion for a while that once the market matures a little (with eg Audi, VW, Porsche all offering their first-gen EVs) Tesla's offerings will be seen as more revolutionary (or at least, taken less for granted) than they currently are...

[nickbarnwell]

The least expensive Model 3 in Germany is 57.900 EUR with 540km (wltp cycle) of range – part of this is that they've only been exporting the high margin long-range AWD models. The more expensive "First Edition" id.3 will have approx 425km of range for 35.000 > x < 40.000EUR. Even taking the top end of that range, it seems the $:km ratio is in favour of the VW. If the First Edition battery is equal in size to the yet-to-be-released 58kWh battery, it seems the efficiency is at least comparable to the M3 as well.

Plus, you probably get a better interior. Certainly a better built one…

[martythemaniak]

Looking at Tesla Germany, Standard Range Plus is 44.5k euros, which includes partial premium interior and autopilot. The SR+ Model 3 is price competitive with Kia/Hyundai, so I'm skeptical that VW will be able to pull some rabbit out of a hat and change that.

[gsnedders]

Note there are Skoda and SEAT cars based on the same platform also coming soon, which are in many ways more obvious competitors for Kia/Hyundai. I would not expect the Volkswagen Group's VW product to be the low end of their pricing.

[adamvalve]

If the interior is anything like my Tiguan... I would greatly prefer my Model 3 any day. I don't think the ID3 is going to come with a premium interior... haven't seen any photos of it so I could be wrong.

[ilikehurdles]

I might be mistaken, but it's a 20k euro price difference isn't it? I'd hope the Model 3 has at least a nicer interior to justify the cost.

[vinay427]

You may have missed the context in the comment they replied to. I don't believe anything in the comment you replied to contradicts what you said.

> Plus, you probably get a better interior. Certainly a better built one…

[Shivetya]

Some pictures captured of the Seat version of the ID.3 match up very well with glimpses of the ID.3 interior.

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/seat/100354/new-seat-el-born-c...

[ricardobeat]

I hope this is not it. Looks cramped like an economy car, with the massive center console and fat door covers.

[_ph_]

Since shortly, also the short range+ model is available for 45k, so getting much closer to the VW price.

[sabareesh]

I dont get people keep complaining about Tesla interior. I love the interior on my model 3 much better than any car I have been in. Can you list some of the things you dont like

[nickbarnwell]

Though much improved since the early days, both the 3 and the S have considerably worse fit and finish and material quality than competitively priced vehicles. Whether for weight, cost, or complexity savings, they also eschew a lot of sound deadening material.

A $50,000 C class or A4 has a far nicer cabin than anything Tesla has produced, and when you start moving up into E or F segment vehicles the difference is even more pronounced. My 2010 B8 wagon with 115k on it has fewer creaks and rattles than a coworker's 2016 S with a third of that.

Infotainment wise, I find Audi's Virtual Cockpit to be incredibly well done and quite like MMI as a whole. I've not used the latest BMW or MB product that's just been released recently, but both seem to be garnering quite good reviews.

[sabareesh]

Definitely it has come long way, the model 3 i have has not creeks or anything like that and with infotainment sure Tesla needs bit more features to be added on bluetooth integration but, I love the simplicity of the car is hard to describe and cockpit on the car almost feels like a spaceship. I almost feel I am outside the car and not inside.

[zaroth]

> I almost feel I am outside the car and not inside.

I know exactly what you mean.

Driving without the lights of the instrument cluster shining at your from behind the steering wheel is amazing.

Just you and the road.

The handling and acceleration on the Tesla is supreme, a nice night drive on a curvy road is like a dream.

[threeseed]

Just need one. It looks and feels cheap.

Very much similar to what you would get in a Hyundai or Mazda.

Go spend some time in a new Audi, Mercedes, Range Rover and you will see the difference.

[sabareesh]

I guess you have not driven a Tesla yet. I would recommend experience Tesla for more than a day it just changes everything.

[Fins]

Unless it comes with Elon's Reality Distortion Generator(tm) these days, no, it doesn't.

Unless your goal is getting an EV for the sake of getting an EV (Tesla's are certainly best here so far), thew only thing that spending more than a day in a Tesla changes is that I want to go kick Elon's behind even harder.

[shapiro92]

ehmm what? the 30k is for 330 km the 44k is for 420 km the XXk is for 550 km

Model 3 comes at around 45k for the 550km and includes autopilot and an amazing interior.

[andrewmunsell]

All you really have to do is look at the current e-Tron and iPace efficiency numbers-- the Model X, which is a heavier vehicle with a smaller battery, goes farther.

[Fins]

Audi and Jaguar are also luxury cars, and X isn't.

[sabareesh]

Ok how do you define luxury car.

[Fins]

Quality, amenities, service experience, stuff like that. Not making things inherently more dangerous is nice, too.

[sabareesh]

Model 3 is safest production car to the date, as most of the car components are integrated problems can be fixed remotely but still when you have to get to Service Center Tesla is notably improving it. Quality of Tesla drive train, battery, efficiency, supercharger network, software ecosystem, Autopilot (which is best driver assist system available now) .

[rasz]

nothing says luxury like Jaguars laggy infotainment ala $30 android tablet

[Fins]

Jaguar's old supplier of electric parts was known as "the prince of darkness"...

I'll take laggy infotainment over a system where you have to use touchscreen to adjust temperature any day, though. Nothing says "a responsible car maker" like having autopilot drive you into a firetruck while you're fiddling with the touchscreen.

[new_realist]

The Model X also looks like it was shit out of a dinosaur. Looks matter, even if range suffers.

[nuriaion]

Also i would assume that the non-Tesla offerings will be cheaper. What i saw about the automobile industry ist that they are very good in building factories/supply chain's where they can produce as cheap as possible. The setup of such a supply chain takes years but when it's there i assume that the prices will be lower than Tesla's. (Also so far i know Tesla need's still a relativ big amout of work hours per car, 60h compare to 30h industry standard)

[pbreit]

I think Tesla was smart to appeal initially to the European automotive fans. I've bought German all my life but my next car will be a Tesla.

Think I think the made-in-America customers will come around.

I think the Asian car fans will be a little trickier because of the price/quality proposition. Although it seems like the Prius fans are already coming over.

[threeseed]

Might want to look into the service situation before buying a Tesla.

Seems to be an area that never gets properly talked about and we've seen examples posted of people waiting up to a year for repairs. That's completely unacceptable.

[martythemaniak]

My opinion is that the best way to cut through all the opinionating is to actually buy an EV. For most people, buying an EV is still a far-away, abstract notion so I wouldn't put much stock in their opinions until they spend the money.

[m463]

I think what people are going to find out is that teslas last a lot longer.

I've seen tesla model s cars with 300,000 miles on the odometer.

You have to think in terms of range * cycles.