[SubiculumCode]

They get some more next month.

The idea of basic income is not equality of outcomes, its equality of opportunity.

The problem I have with most socialist policies is not that funds shouldn't be provided to help the poor/everyone, but because the plans often are designed around the belief that individuals should not be trusted to make decisions about their own lives.

I believe in a fiscally liberal libertarian policy..Federal money should be distributed to individuals and local governments without any strings attached, because only the Federal government has the power of printing currency to meet the public good.

In aggregate, I do trust people to make good decisions, and those that do will get rewarded.

[luckylion]

> They get some more next month.

So no food for them for the rest of the month? Good luck with that.

[zensavona]

> But what if someone gambles away their {salaried | welfare | annuity | retirement | pension} income, or has it scammed from them? Tough luck, back to the streets?

Either people are treated like adults and manage their own finances, or we are all wards of the state to some degree.

[grahamburger]

> But what if someone gambles away their {salaried | welfare | annuity | retirement | pension} income, or has it scammed from them? Tough luck, back to the streets?

This is exactly what happens today, and it's ostensibly the problem that UBI is attempting to solve. If UBI doesn't solve that problem then it's just a very expensive waste of resources.

[luckylion]

> Either people are treated like adults and manage their own finances, or we are all wards of the state to some degree.

If they were adults with the ability to manage their finances, make smart decisions etc, only a tiny fraction of them would have to rely on the state in the first place, so that's not convincing to me.

[tuukkah]

If you lose all your money so that you have nothing to eat for the month, then you need social care for sorting out issues.

[luckylion]

That's kinda my point: UBI is supposed to replace all other welfare programs. There won't be anything else.

[tuukkah]

The way I have understood UBI, it would replace benefits and allowances but not programs such as universal health care or universal social care - I suppose it depends on how you define a welfare program.

[luckylion]

It probably also depends on where you discuss it. My understanding is that it would replace pretty much everything else (programs for rent, food, clothes etc are gone). Where a public health system (as in the UK) exists, it might continue unchanged, where it's privately organized (Germany) but premiums for the poor are paid by the state, the state would pay out the money instead.

[tuukkah]

I should add free (higher) education on my list. At least in the Finnish version, the aims are to remove means testing (reduce bureaucracy, avoid incentive traps) and to make the chance to live a humane life independent of employment and past life decisions. The aim is not to reduce the society into a monthly payment for those who need the help of the society in health, education etc.

[SubiculumCode]

UBI is generally not a replacement for health care or for mental health services. In any case, there are numerous people who trade their food benefits for drug money already.

[SubiculumCode]

Perhaps after having little to eat, they'll spend their $1,000 freedom dividend on some food on the 1st of the month. Lesson learned.