[subjectHarold]

Ignoring the fact that a lot of the land has changed hands since then (the issue is concentration not identity of owners...a dangerous conflation): are you saying that a morality test should be applied to the family tree of all property purchasers?

I am sure this is attractive to you because you are a member of the "virtuous class" no doubt, but have you checked your family tree? How far back? What genetic crimes prohibit property ownership? Class traitor? Rightist? Capitalist Roader? Perhaps religion?

And why do these people still own land? Presumably you aren't personally being pressed into involuntary labour, so why do you as someone who is doing "all the work" still have nothing? These inbred landowners are presumably so feckless they would take anything (certainly, lots of these estates go for sale every year).

[jacobolus]

If you go far enough back in my family tree of European peasants, I’m sure there are plenty of bastard children of feudal lords in there. Not to mention thieves, killers, psychopaths, abusers, and so on. Likewise, I’m sure there are plenty of aristocrats (both historically and today) who are lovely people who treat their servants pleasantly and pay them above market wages, and so on.

That’s not the point. The point is that a small group today shouldn’t be the inheritors of the entire society’s wealth. We shouldn’t be judging people today based on the actions of distant ancestors. And the way to avoid that judgement is for the majority of absurdly wealthy people’s property to devolve to the state when they die.

[pdonis]

> And the way to avoid that judgement is for the majority of absurdly wealthy people’s property to devolve to the state when they die.

That just makes the state the owner of most of the society's wealth--which in practice means the small group of people who control the state own it. How is this better?

[laum]

Because it’s far easier for someone with a great vision about how to use the state’s wealth for everybody’s benefit to get themselves elected to the governing body than it is for them to get themselves reincarnated as an aristocrat.

[prepend]

Is it though? In the US, I think, it’s far easier for someone to make a billion dollars, and thus be able to buy a bunch of land or whatnot, than it is for a president or major politician to be elected with a clear enough vision to do something.

I base this on the number of new billionaires vs the number of major new political initiatives.

I think it’s quite easy to have a vision, but very difficult to filter those through the will of the people. In the sense that a great vision is very subjective and may not be believed by the large number of people necessary to change things in a constitutional republic.

[pdonis]

> someone with a great vision about how to use the state’s wealth for everybody’s benefit

History shows that such people are much, much rarer than people who have a great vision about how to use wealth they have either inherited or built up themselves for everybody's benefit. Or, to put it another way, people with a great vision that will actually work are far more likely to become entrepreneurs than politicians. Bill Gates is eradicating malaria using his own wealth while governments have failed to do so for centuries.

[snidane]

I agree. But it can be made simpler than that. If the owner actually wants his land property to be inherited, why shouldn't he pay for the property protection over his life himself? If he convinced the society that he really is the owner this way, I don't think the society would have found this private land property or inheritancee unethical.

What they find disturbing though is that they as a society have to pay for all these property related services like internal protection (police, courts, law system) like external protection (army) and give these to the sitting and do-nothing landlords for free. While paying for them from their pocket through income taxes and receiving nothing back.. Actually the landlords are then so kind as to increase their home rents as a Thank you.

[subjectHarold]

Okay, that isn't the point...but that is what you said: "why should the family whose main claim to fame is aggressive use of force"...how else is this supposed to be interpreted? Because of someone's ancestors, this group shouldn't own property. If you want to make a different point, then make it.

And it isn't random. You can acquire this property if you want. But be aware, you seem to be expecting to acquire the "entire society's wealth"...most of this land isn't that valuable and that land that is requires work (which is why it is valuable).

Again, I don't understand what your point is here beyond anger that someone else has something you want?

EDIT: Are you actually familiar with the population distribution and density in Scotland? A good chunk of this land is just agriculture and rough grass that has few economic uses. This isn't land that anyone wants to live on. The main concern of the govt, as I understand it, is to encourage forestry (which will mean more large owners, not less).

[jacobolus]

In the western US, most land is owned by the federal government, which on the whole does a pretty decent job of forest management.

Why should large landholdings beyond individuals’ management abilities be left to particular families?

[petre]

Maybe that's why English settlers went to the US in the first place. The UK did not have a French style revolution.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/land-reform/Types-of-reform