[chillacy]

Democracy usually follows economic development, not vice versa. Look at South Korea and Taiwan, they grew tremendously under authoritarian regimes and became democratic later after their GDP per capita hit a threshold (Singapore is somewhere in between, still pretty authoritarian).

[Nasrudith]

I wonder if it is a proxy for sufficient education essentially (even a high school educated populace who can read the paper and instruction manuals can generate more wealth via factory work than subsidence farmers) vs simple hierarchy of needs where their main concerns are survival as opposed to any ideals like liberty or equality.

Quality education isn't a pancaea for demagoguery but it certainly helps. I believe that educated middle and lower end of upper class have been involved with revolutions frequently for better or worse outcomes.

[chillacy]

They definitely correlate. In a democracy, you need a high level of education among all your voters since everyone can have an input on policy. And I'm sure more educated people start demanding for more representation.

Lee Kwan Yew of Singapore had some interesting things to say about it all: https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2015/03/le...

[sexy_seedbox]

Not going to happen with Xi "President for Life" Jinping.

[chillacy]

Not going to happen... during our lifetimes? Ever? If you went to vegas and put money on it, what would you place the odds at if you put down serious money?

I only ask because your comment sounds like a very certain prediction, but few things are that certain beyond physics.

[asdfologist]

Korea had a dictator too.

[appsonify]

They grew tremendously because they turned their citizens into commodities at the hands of a few families who were able to bribe their way to the top.

Samsung, Hyundai, all of these guys built their company on the backs of children, women, and men which they exploited the shit out of.

Now, young Koreans are asking, was it worth it? With one of the highest youth unemployment and suicide rates in East Asia, existential questions are being raised about the authoritarian past.

I would've agreed with your statement 10 years ago, but now I'm not so certain, and I firmly believe that everybody is just repeating the government propaganda.

How the fuck is it that everybody just seem to know that authoritarian was responsible for economic revival? It's not even for debate. Yet we have countries like North Korea, still unable to dig themselves out of the economic recession. Argentina, South America, all had similar authoritarians and dictators, the only difference being that they possessed natural commodities that the Western countries could bribe and extract it out of that target country.

It's not exactly a secret as to the extent of subversive & covert actions of American corporations in exploiting South America for their rich natural resources. ex) United Fruit

When you don't have anything your land can provide to the empire, they accept human collateral, in the form of labor (slave?) or mercenaries. ex) South Korea's participation in the Vietnam War was traded for billions of dollars in US aid, that were spent on building the country's infrastructure.

Why is it that we have to be the richest? Why is it such a fucking competition, and why do we not stop and think, what the fuck is the reward at the end of the race created by Yet Another Empire?

[chillacy]

You seem angry, you're right, we don't really get a say in the matter.

I also can't say if authoritarianism leads to economic revival, only that revival happened in spite of authoritarianism. In the same way that the Philippines has not done much economically in spite of democracy.

I can't say if it's worth it in the end, maybe the fisherman in Thailand is happier. But I'm grateful for the life I live. I've traveled around Asia, I've seen the developed and the non-developed, and I would prefer economic power over the latter.

[appsonify]

yeah sometimes I just get jaded by how materialistic and superficial North American culture is.

as a visible minority, I honestly cannot have the same things that a white person would have without capital. This is just a fact of reality, no matter if I was born here or my kids are mixed, we will never be regarded as true equals. I hate what I have become. Just another immigrant that made it with a bit of money. But I needed to make this money just to have a shot at being treated equally by the mainstream.

It'd be nice to be accepted for who I am, not what I have. I long to be in a culture and society that isn't so materially obsessed...like Berlin.

it's nauseating....I think I need to leave North America for good....the North American Dream ultimately was revealed to me, just a futile exercise in consumption and mostly a dick measuring contest about who has what.

I can't believe I ditched thousands of years of culture and history for this fucking uncultured garbage they call the American Dream.

[chillacy]

I traveled around for a few months and even though I'm back in the States I've become happier just knowing there's somewhere in the world where I'd blend in, and other parts where I now get the equivalent of what one would call privilege here. The world's a big and diverse place, don't wait till it's too late to see it.