Hacker News new | ask | show | jobs
by etaty 2694 days ago
Does that mean goods produced by coal on the other side of the border are still okay to be imported? (pointing finger at Poland, or even China)
2 comments

Why do you feel the need to phrase your talking point in the form of a thinly veiled rhetorical question?

In any case: yes, obviously. Although Germany works both within the EU and the UN climate process to find collective solutions allowing other nations to also reduce emissions. China is actually becoming a positive example these days, installing vast amounts of renewable energy.

Phasing out coal in Germany obviously makes for a good argument in such talks. But even if it doesn’t, not burning coal and buying from China is still strictly better than burning coal and buying from China.

It’s sort of like smoking and getting regular exercise is better than just smoking.

Does it though? If Germany's policies hurt the economy, at a time when the cost of energy goes up, it may threaten the plans. The last thing a costly reform needs is less money to spend.

Ignoring possible second order effects is a dangerous course of action. The nuclear shutdown in Germany was so bad not just for emissions (which have gotten worse) but also, as the Marginal Revolution article above points out, geopolitically as well. One decision can have a multitude of flow on bad effects.

The important part to remember is that the goal is not clean energy. The goal is for humanity to continue to exist and, if possible, to prosper. That is why climate change is awful, as it threatens our species. Not the planet. The planet will be fine. It is our species that is at risk.

Decisions made for vague, second effect ignoring reasons are worrying, especially when there are known second order effect consequences.

From my point of view, this is only about the general electricity generation. I mean, a lot of people are still using lignite to warm their house in the winter and knowing the lifetime of personal homes in Europe, we cannot really expect that to end in the next 50 years (though not for newly build ones though).
Less than 1% of German homes are using coal for heating.

https://www.deutsche-handwerks-zeitung.de/so-heizt-deutschla...

For the primary source of general heating yes. As a secondary to heat the living room oven, I highly doubt that, too many relatives that I just bought lignite with last autumn. Could be more prominent in eastern Germany though.
There isn't much coal used - you will have a hard time finding a coal supply in many cities. Some regions in eastern Germany and in the Rhine/Ruhr region...

Since coal mines are being closed, the miners will not get any more coal (as part of their salary) and thus they are looking for alternatives:

https://www.gelsenwasser.de/unternehmen/presse/pressearchiv/...

I've never seen a coal oven in a home. All those "Kachelöfen" and "Kamine" are being fed wood, in several forms.
Subsidies for modernizing homes exist for a long time in Germany: Tax credits, super cheap loans (0.75% p.a.), financial aid (not having to pay back up to 30kEUR)...

Among the supported measures is: modernizing heating systems.