[billy_beef]

> Iirc there are even physical reasons why it is more difficult to identify black faces than white faces. Is that then racist, if an algorithm struggles more with identifying black faces?

Unless there is some physics based reason it is orders of magnitude more difficult to do feature detection against black skin, then yes something racist is going on. The tools/cameras that we've designed have historically been metered and measured on their ability to detect white features/skin. This was a holdover from film that translated to digital photography. (Some info from an NPR interview https://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2014/04/16/303721251...). The tools that perform this feature detection contain this same biases and reproduce it in the data that they collect. If an algorithm struggles more with identifying black skin, it's because the data that was used to the produce the algorithm contained unexamined racial bias that was never corrected for in a serious way.

[adlkjnndnnd]

Then I would say racial bias is not the same as racism. You can not really blame the people who developed those tools for not being surrounded by people of all races, or for the use case of, say, white people. It's not a malicious intent, whereas racism implies malice.

It seems to me many US citizens think the whole world is like the US. It isn't. There are many countries where there are not as many "races" living together as in the US.

I think it's an important point. For example, if I were a writer and I would write a novel, I would perhaps only feature white people in it. But not because I have anything against black people, but simply because I don't really know any black people and would therefore be hard pressed to write about them. Doing that wouldn't make me racist - I would simply write a novel from "my" world. It would in fact probably be impossible to write a novel that accounts for all possible human experiences.

Edit: would it even have been possible to calibrate chemical film to work equally well for black and white skin? What if it would have been necessary to have different film rolls for white and black skin, for optimal result. Would those have been racist film rolls? Or what about makeup for different skin tones? Is that racist?

[billy_beef]

[flagged]

[adlkjnndnnd]

[flagged]

[billy_beef]

You should perhaps begin by educating yourself to the actual role that Germany did play in the colonization of the African continent in the late 19th and early 20th century: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_colonial_empire . I would not call this particularly far in history since it only ended in the 1910s.

[adlkjnndnnd]

They were late to the party and I don't think their "efforts" were comparable to that of some other prominent nations.

But it doesn't really matter, as I said. Nobody who was around back then is still alive today.

[dragonwriter]

> But it doesn't really matter, as I said. Nobody who was around back then is still alive today.

Did the people that were alive then give back their ill-gotten gains to the exploited, or did they retain and pass on their advantaged position to their heirs who leveraged them for further gains?

[billy_beef]

My point here was to demonstrate the way in which your nation's present day wealth was bolstered by its historical oppression. The labor value that European nations were able to extract from their colonies was extremely high. The nation you currently live in benefitted materially from this. You benefitted from this. That probably doesn't feel good to hear but it is not a fact you can choose to accept or not.

It's also important to remember that when comparing the magnitude of atrocities, both things were still atrocities.

[billy_beef]

[flagged]

[adlkjnndnnd]

It's all besides the point. As I said, you will find violence, slavery and murder in every person's ancestors history, if you go back far enough.

But also, I don't feel guilty for the deeds of my nation, as they happened before my birth. I feel we have a duty to learn from history to prevent bad things from happening. That's it.

If you really want to go down that route - you are aware that the USA was taken away from native Americans, who died by the millions?

[billy_beef]

[flagged]

[billy_beef]

> If you want to go down that route, consider that many people in Africa also benefited from slavery (black tribes selling their enemies as slaves).

Yeah, that's gonna be a yikes from me dawg.

[dang]

We've banned this account. This is not a site for political or ideological battle. Please see https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html.

If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email [e-mail] and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future.

[adlkjnndnnd]

Why? What? What is your point?