[vqrs]

I just tried poetry because of this thread. So I can't really talk about poetry, but I can share my frustration with pipenv.

First, the best thing I like about pipenv is `pipenv shell`. It's integration with virtualenvs is really good and a joy to use.

I think the CLI usage is really confusing. Every time I wanted to do something, I googled what the correct way was and often found github issues about stuff I was struggling with.

I don't think the defaults are intuitive, it's not clear when pipenv actually touches the lock file, when it just reinstalls everything and likes to make me wait 10 minutes. I don't understand why `pipenv install something` will also often also touch unrelated packages, why `pipenv install` even changes the lock file. Yes, I learned that I'm supposed to use `pipenv sync`, but whose idea was that? It's not even mentioned in the basic concepts, so maybe I still misunderstood something?

When I found poetry because of this thread, it was like someone had read my mind: https://github.com/sdispater/poetry#what-about-pipenv

I had hope when I found this: https://github.com/pypa/pipenv/issues/1463#issuecomment-3677... but my use of pipenv this past month was still very frustrating. Also, I don't really see how I can use pipenv on windows and on linux for the same project when the OS is stored inside the lock file.