[AltruisticGap]

Put very curedly, they're getting high.

And, everybody's getting high.

Life is about pleasure.

If you found out that you can feel really, really good by sitting and doing nothing... would you do it? Of course you would. :)

Now the stark reality however, is that to be able to sit and meditate properly requires to be already at home in the body. Any amount of trauma will make that particularly difficult. As soon as you sit, you have to work through restlessness, anxiety, and myriad of other unpleasant states of mind. And they all come up.. it's like a purge of the nervous system.

In fact I was just recently reading an article about the unexpected side effects of meditation. This is not talked about enough.

Meditation Is a Powerful Mental Tool—and For Some People It Goes Terribly Wrong

https://tonic.vice.com/en_us/article/vbaedd/meditation-is-a-...

edit: forgot this beautiful quote: "First, you chase the truth. Then truth chases you".

[crispinb]

Yet most spiritual disciplines proffer strictures against chasing pleasurable meditative states. They can arise, but are generally not supposed to be sought, nor held on to. After arising, they fall away, and that is fine - all the same to a serious meditator.

However you might assess such disciplines (I'm not sure myself), it's pretty clear that pleasure and getting high is absolutely not their aim - indeed attachment to such would be considered a hindrance to 'progress'.

[sooheon]

Those just seem to be more rarified forms of pleasure for experts. It's like forgoing the gatorade to savor crystal clear water after a run, or something.

[crispinb]

That would seem to be a use of the term 'pleasure' rarifying it beyond meaningful use ;)

[vbuwivbiu]

"If you found out that you can feel really, really good by sitting and doing nothing... would you do it? Of course you would. :)"

Nope, I'd go for walk. Meditation is passive and lazy. Being outside in nature with the sounds of the birds and the UV light, being actually connected with the universe, being alive.

[crispinb]

> Meditation is passive and lazy

It truly is neither. "Passive" meditation would be daydreaming, which all meditation techniques aim to minimise. Hardly 'lazy' either - retreat drop-out rates are high precisely because it can be really, really hard to muster the will to maintain the required discpline for hours (and days) at at time.

> Nope, I'd go for walk

Most meditation traditions include walking practises.

[dwaltrip]

> Meditation is passive and lazy.

Meditation is about training the mind to be more aware, more purposefully attentive, and more equanimous. As you can imagine, there are many benefits to achieving this.

It's not simply sitting and daydreaming, even though it can sometimes feel like that as a beginner, which is totally normal :)

For beginners, the important part is to just practice noticing each instance of daydreaming or getting lost thinking about something, without judgment. Each time one notices it is actually a victory to enjoy, not a bad thing.

[cgag]

You can meditate while walking if you want to, or meditate while sitting outside in the sun. Not that going for a walk period isn't great.