[Gineton2]

I think he's referring to the scale of left-right in Europe and South America. Meaning the "center" in Europe and South America has usually been more to the left of the "center" in the United States. So a Bay Area minimal-regulation, minimal-government libertarian would be far-right relative to the average right-wing "liberal" in Europe/SoAmerica, who might be ok with more market regulation and a safety net for the poor.

[antidesitter]

"Far-right" refers to nationalism, fascism, and authoritarianism, not libertarianism.

Also, I wouldn't call the Bay Area "minimal-regulation".

[goldfeld]

Nationalism maybe, but then libertarianism and nationalism aren't necessarily any more right-leaning than the other, it isn't clear-cut. Outside the US bubble (including South American politics bending over to the american way of life--a foregone notion) libertarianism is seen as pretty extreme and elitist, if not very naive and hopeful instead. Actual fascism and authoritarianism are totalitarian, dystopic realities, maybe extreme right but even that would more often be conflated with far-right than with totalitarian regimes, which in a way are already beyond "normal" (parliamentary and such) politics and more like, you know, a dictatorship, or the seizing of power with disregard for the constitution.

[antidesitter]

> Outside the US bubble... libertarianism is seen as pretty extreme and elitist.

I doubt it. What's your evidence for this?

> South American politics bending over to the american way of life--a foregone notion

What does this mean?

[goldfeld]

Well, far-right thinking is on the rise as of late, so perhaps you're right. People outside the US are being deluded into thinking libertarianism will solve economic woes, among other harebrained solutions. Economic woes themselves have a way of messing with people's rationality.

I was just about to edit that comment to make it more explicit, that the american way of life is the foregone notion, not bending over to the US. People keep bending over to the US, the right-wing of South America has mostly always done that, and what it means is that they think the American Way of doing politics brings prosperity and a good economy. And what I mean by foregone notion is that the current good economy of the US is an illusion. The society is sick and degrading. The economy keeps going strong, apparently. But it can't last, because a weak society can't make an economy strong, disillusioned young people can't keep creating extraordinary value for much longer (5, 10 years?) The economy is still good because of inertia, but something is broken in good old America, what used to work in the golden age of the past century isn't holding up well behind the stages, even if the show appears to go on for now.

[antidesitter]

> Well, far-right thinking is on the rise as of late, so perhaps you're right.

Far-right does not mean libertarianism. To use the word in that way while knowing its authoritarian connotations is insincere.

> People outside the US are being deluded into thinking libertarianism will solve economic woes, among other harebrained solutions.

What is "delusional" and "harebrained" about libertarian policies?

> People keep bending over to the US, the right-wing of South America has mostly always done that, and what it means is that they think the American Way of doing politics brings prosperity and a good economy.

What constitutes "the right-wing of South America"? What do you mean by "the American Way"?

> The society is sick and degrading.

Can you be more specific?

[goldfeld]

I think all your further inquiry is valid but comes down to a political opinion and it might be that ours are opposite on the spectrum, so it might as well be a rhetoric questioning, and in any case such an in-depth conversation would be better served face-to-face or even by an essay. I might be tempted to write it but I think the arguments for my side are tired by 2018 and I'd much rather write about many other topics of interest, but thanks for the discussion, I really appreciate it.