[dogma1138]

Labour’s position should be to oppose Brexit and to remain or rejoin, that is not however Corbyn’s position it never was and for the past 2 years he showed that he is not fit as a leader because he can’t bend his ideals to the will of his party.

Corbyn wants socialism, he want to nationalize the industries he wants to get rid of the neoliberal keynesian economics which the EU and every other social democracy in Europe promotes and follows he doesn’t want to be in the EU he was against the U.K. joining the EU in the first place and he didn’t do anything to prevent it from leaving.

[digianarchist]

> Labour’s position should be to oppose Brexit and to remain or rejoin

Why? It hasn't been agreed at conference.

There's a party for Remainers that want to ignore the referendum result they're called the Liberal Democrats or the SNP if you are up in Scotland.

[dogma1138]

Because that’s the majority of it’s members and people who vote for them want, they supposed to be an opposition party.

If Corbyn wants to run his own personal personality cult he should go form another party.

[jwdunne]

And of the 52% that voted for brexit? The problem I've found in politics is that politicians like to 'switch' their mandate depending on what's convenient. Half the time, rebellious MPs justify their behaviour by saying their "mandate comes from their constituents". So what of brexit? The majority of Labour MPs represent pro-leave constituencies. Now the same people are saying it's the "will of the membership" when that means nothing at all over any other issue.

I'm pro-Remain but I think Corbyn has been misrepresented by our media and colleagues so much that he's not going to do well no matter what. Christ, he was criticised for wearing a coat in typical British weather laying a wreath at the cenotaph.

That said, there is a section of the Labour party that has formed a dangerous echo chamber. I was routinely attacked by "friends" after saying Assad is an oppressive dictator. I was called names like "white supremacist imperialist" and, almost as bad, a Blairite. I left the party because it's a festering whole of negativity, anger and irrationality. I have misgivings about those people influencing policy, which it would invariably would via conference if Labour attained power.

[dogma1138]

52% of Labour voters didn’t vote for leave, I’m not saying everyone in the U.K. should support remain but the overwhelming majority of all Labour Party members and voters currently support remain, Labour is an opposition party as such they should support remain or rejoin.

The fact that Labour MPs had to rebel against their leader to support things like the 2nd referendum or a people’s vote on the deal does not bode well for what they are supposed to stand for.

[jwdunne]

That wasn't the point I was trying to make. It's where the mandate comes from is fluid. I'm saying these same people have rebelled many times against what members want because "their constituents". It changes to suit their justification. Who's needs to do we favour? The constituents of the members?

I'm a remainer. I think the party should back remain and Corbyn is mistaken for not backing a second vote. But after the past behaviour of these rebellious MPs, I don't believe they're any better.

The other issue is that the majority of Labour votes come from leave areas. That's the other part of the 52% problem. We can placate the members at the potential loss of our core voters.

[dogma1138]

Again this isn't about Brexit in general but about the Labour's stance on it.

Officially the were supposed to support remain, their members support remain, their MPs support remain, their voters support remain and all overwhelmingly.

Corbyn is a Eurosceptic and that's the problem the are supposed to oppose the Tories and Brexit but Corbyn does whatever he can other than gleefully dancing in the street in support of finally leaving.

He didn't support his party in opposition leading to the referendum, in fact he went MIA during the critical weeks and days leading to it, he turns down the option for a 2nd referendum which the majority of his party supports and turns down the option for a people's vote on the final deal.

He did absolutely nothing as the leader of the opposition to bring forth legislation that would support the retraction of Article 50, a soft-Brexit with the possibility of rejoining the EU or anything that actually opposes the shit show that has been going on for the past 2 years.

The only thing he did it marginalize his party in the eyes of many Labour voters.

>The other issue is that the majority of Labour votes come from leave areas. That's the other part of the 52% problem. We can placate the members at the potential loss of our core voters.

The majority of labour voters want to remain, this was always the case now it's even more as over 1.4M labour voters that voted leave in the election now want to remain.

The crazy socialists that want the UK to leave the EU in order to get rid of the EU competitive laws so they could nationalize everything and finally have their venezuela are not the core of the Labour party they never were and hopefully never will be because that would be a dark day for the UK.

In the Brexit referendum 65% of Labour voters voted remain, 68% of LDs vote to remain, LD wasn't any more pro-remain than the Labour, both of them are now at around 80% support for remain.

[lumberjack]

Labour is a socialist worker's party. The LibDems exist. Why don't you join them? Why do you want to disenfranchise the socialists and take over the party?

[evgen]

I would probably guess that this would be because according to recent polling the vast majority of the members of this socialist worker's party actually support a people's vote. Is commissar Corbyn the only one that gets a vote?

[dogma1138]

So that’s why the Labour and the left wing media in the U.K. attacks anyone who calls them socialists and mocks them as perpetuating the red scare?

So either the Labour isn’t for socialists or they are hiding it to be palletable to their wide voting base.

The average Labour voter wants Denmark not Venezuela they want a better social democracy not breadlines and shooting people in the street.