[CPLX]

This is obviously and painfully false.

There is a fundamental difference between journalism and advertising.

When you see people advancing this point of view it's always worth pausing to notice and reflect on who benefits from efforts to erode this distinction.

[pixl97]

Painfully false, I'm not so sure.

If a media organization is fully user supported then they are separate. The problem, at least in US media, our media is almost completely advertising supported. The editors of the organization always have to be mindful of upsetting the people that actually pay for the service. This can put a deep and hidden bias in the reporting structure.

[keiferski]

You think media organizations aren’t trying to push a particular narrative? They’ve been doing this since yellow journalism, Hearst and Pulitzer over a hundred years ago. Every side of the political spectrum does this.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_New_York_Times_controver...

> When you see people advancing this point of view...

This is an ad hominem and not an argument.

[CPLX]

"Pushing a particular narrative" or generally having a point of view is not the same thing as advertising.

It's undeniable that there are biases and preferences in journalism, and that there's no such thing as a truly objective point of view. Journalism is made by humans.

But that's a fundamentally different argument than equating advertising with journalism. They aren't the same. Fact-checked reported journalism that attempts to be objective is fundamentally a different thing.

And it's also a factual statement to say that there is an organized effort to obscure this difference, and that this effort benefits specific groups.

[hammock]

There is an issue of semantics and nomenclature here. Essentially, the basic point is:

Journalism and advertising are both products (distinct as they are) being sold thru the same media, e.g. a newspaper or a 30-minute cable TV timeslot.

[reggieband]

I consider that the earliest strain of this thought that I am aware of is from Noam Chomsky, who wrote in 1988 the book Manufacturing Consent [1]. There is also the 1985 book Amusing Ourselves to Death by Neil Postman [2].

I think it is fair to say the clarion call of "Fake News" has been around longer than some people think and spans across the political spectrum. In fact, when I hear people insist that CNN or some other mass-media outlets are the cure for alt-right and/or Donald Trump, I wonder if they remember the time not so long ago where they were considered the prime enemies of the left.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manufacturing_Consent [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amusing_Ourselves_to_Death