[unit91]

Have you considered that this belief system is unlivable? Or maybe deep, down inside, you don't actually believe it?

If you believed it, and you were consistent, why did you post what you did? If you don't matter (I think you do matter tremendously), and if nobody who reads it matters, then your post doesn't matter.

But you do matter. And so do we. And you know it because you spoke up. Why do you matter? That's the question. Because you were created in the image of God.

[_khau]

Presuming to know someones mind better than they do themselves is the height of arrogance.

It's even more arrogant when you are citing fairy tales as the evidence that you have some insight into the subject that they do not.

[unit91]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presuppositional_apologetics

[ionised]

Is this wikipedia page supposed to make a point?

[meko]

It is indeed livable, you just may not be able to conceive how it is so. Contrary to what many think, nihilism is not just the assertion that reality lacks meaning, but a philosophy based around the implications of such a reality. To paraphrase, we are the ones, on an individual and collective level, who assign meaning to our experiences and encounters. Put simply, everything matters because nothing matters.

[larkery]

There's another solution to this question (or maybe the same one in different words). I believe something similar, but I still do things - why do I do things? Why write this message?

The question seems like a show-stopper.

Then again, the trees I can see outside my window don't believe pointing their leaves at the sun matters or bears meaning, nor do the planets consider turning in their orbits. Nevertheless, they continue to do these things!

What is the difference between me, and these other systems? Why do I need to Ultimately Matter to live?

[unit91]

> Why do I need to Ultimately Matter to live?

I think we're thinking of "unlivable" in two different senses. When I said "belief system is unlivable" I didn't mean you can't agree with it and live. I meant you can't live as though it's actually true. You can't be consistent with it and live.

Why take care of yourself if you don't matter? Why help other people if they are as irrelevant as your help? Why participate in thoughtful discussion if nobody matters, and neither do the conclusions? Folks who think they have no ultimate value do these (good) things all the time -- but they can't and be consistent with their worldview.

> What is the difference between me, and these other systems?

Simply put, you're human, not a plant or a planet. Humans are volitional, trees and rocks are not. "How can trees live without beliefs?" is analogous to "how can humans live without photosynthesis?" -- because we're fundamentally different.

Human actions are the products of our beliefs. We think and long for significance. Why? If you're a just mass of chemicals, atoms clashing with atoms, why do you long to matter? And if you aren't more significant than the tree, why can't I cut you down if it suits me? The typical responses ("it's beneficial for survival", "society says so", etc.) don't make it wrong inherently, yet we know murder et al. are wrong. Actually wrong. And, if we don't matter, why is survival good? Why is society's opinion good? They wouldn't be, they would just be other possible, equally meaningless, states in the vast, purposeless, eternal state machine.

But you do matter. And it's a divine gift. You matter because you were created to matter.

[0x8BADF00D]

> Human actions are the products of our beliefs. We think and long for significance. Why? If you're a just mass of chemicals, atoms clashing with atoms, why do you long to matter?

Because it’s built-in for your survival. You are optimizing a fitness function. Nature is ultimate. The meme that man has dominion over Earth has led to us raping and pillaging her. We have done horrible things to our mother.

[unit91]

> The meme that man has dominion over Earth has led to us raping and pillaging her. We have done horrible things to our mother.

And none of that matters, on your view, because we and the Earth are temporary. You can't have it both ways.