[jonas21]

> I wonder what Brin would have to say about the issue today, because the facts in China have not changed much since 2010, certainly not to the better.

I wonder about this too.

By this point, it's pretty clear that Google's strategy of leaving China hasn't led to any improvement in China with respect to censorship and individual liberties. Instead, Chinese companies that are willing to do whatever the Chinese government wants without question have filled the gap that Google left.

I wonder if he's concluded that this strategy is a failure and the best way to improve conditions is to re-enter China, even if it means playing by their rules.

[sampo]

These are not easy questions.

Taking this to an absurd level: If the Aztecs still existed and were sacrificing humans with their volcanic rock blades. Should we sell them at least some steel blades, so their victims could die a little quicker and less painful death? Or should we absolutely abstain from selling any weapons to those murderous bastards?

I don't know.

[pas]

We do trade embargoes against North Korea, but not against Saudi Arabia. Maybe because the latter is (or seems) less brutal.

Before a certain size and/or complexity use of force to literally force changes seems like the best option. But above that, there's no point in waging a war for more world happiness.

And then, on the other end of the spectrum we have the sophisticated autocratic propaganda machines (that are democratic in name), where people 4 year after 4 year vote in (almost) the same kleptocrats. Of course the election system favors the ruling party, of course there's a lot of ordinary cheating, of course the ruling party somehow manages to spend many times more on campaigning than the opposition, but the brain washing works, so why not?

[Bendingo]

> Maybe because the latter is (or seems) less brutal Or maybe not [1] [2]

[1] - https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2018/08/sa...

[2] - https://www.businessinsider.com.au/saudi-arabia-crucified-ma...

[ionised]

The idea that you can change the system from within is incredibly naive and usually put forward as a justification for wanting to exploit that system.