[nindalf]

You're missing the forest for the trees. Yes, it is true that the bots was suboptimal and made elementary errors, notably around vision. However, overall they did really well. The mere fact that they could coordinate with each other without explicit communication was very impressive.

On each of the poor utilization of skills, I could counter by saying there were other objectives in play. For example, you didn't mention that the "skill that does more damage for every point of missing health on targets" also happens to freeze the target for 1.5 seconds. Perhaps the goal of the bot was just to hold the enemy in place.

Honestly it's pretty easy to sit around saying "yeah nothing impressive here". But I've been playing this game for a decade and fact is, if I had seen OpenAI 5 a year ago I simply would not have believed it was possible for bots to play this well.

[Ntrails]

> n each of the poor utilization of skills, I could counter by saying there were other objectives in play. For example, you didn't mention that the "skill that does more damage for every point of missing health on targets" also happens to freeze the target for 1.5 seconds. Perhaps the goal of the bot was just to hold the enemy in place.

Using scythe to hold a Bkb'd target in place is a classic use of an immunity piercing stun acknowledging you'll get zero damage. This wasn't the case in the game I watched them play, it was just "a stun". Which is fine, honestly. But they prioritised the stun over the damage and the respawn time increase (which is actually just as important as the damage). I'm not sure I believe they understood all of the aspects of the spell based on how they used it.

The reality remains that the bots are just playing micro level incredible dota, and macro level mediocre dota. There are endless examples. Giving aegis to supports, never stacking creeps for carries, ganking low importance heros, using DP ult to farm jungle.

They're still better than me and probably anyone I'll ever play with. vOv

[kenhwang]

Sure, it stuns, but it was often stacked with other stuns. I don't remember it ever being used on a low health target. So I'm drawing the conclusion that the bot only understands that the skill stuns, but doesn't understand the scaling damage.

It's impressive that the AI managed to gain a rudimentary understanding of the game almost completely independently since DotA2 is a very complicated game. It's just not interesting problem because game mechanics can easily be codified. It's like being impressed at self-driving cars because the AI learned that it should stop at a red light, it should just be coded to stop at a red light. Learning to stop at a red light isn't the interesting problem that needs solving for self-driving cars.

It's definitely not the "AI is better than humans" narrative that these articles like to push.

[abdullahkhalids]

They do in fact broadcast information to teammates [1] in recent versions:

> OpenAI Five sends 512 such values every couple of milliseconds

I think one of the challenges to making the bots play realistic Dota would be to limit this passage of information. I would say only one bot can talk every time period (say 1.5 seconds) and minimum time before new information is broadcast is >0.5 seconds.

[1] https://medium.com/@stelmaszczykadam/do-openai-five-dota-2-b...