[throwaway237468]

The problem is in the last 5% though. If Evan thinks it's a bad idea or requires more thought, you literally can't do it. The websocket package is currently being held hostage because he wants to improve the API. Since you can't include native code even in private projects now, you can't fork and fix numerous bugs that have an open PR for 2 years+. That means I have to stick with 0.18 which has several compiler bugs because 0.18 is not gonna get a bugfix release.

[Existenceblinks]

I don't think it's 5% though. In my feeling it's like 30%. File stuff alone is huge. How about localStorage and other web stuff (yeah websocket and friends)

Anything port talks to is NOT Elm. Any custom element is also NOT elm. I really like some smart people in Elm community, they are kind. But I think they are like 3% of all. The real problem is development process and communication.

[cies]

> The real problem is development process and communication.

Agreed. It's a non-open-access open source project.

[raffomania]

I agree, this is definitely a problem, especially for more ambitious use cases. I've done quite well without e.g. typeclasses, though.

[atrilumen]

I say keep Elm weird, and simple. Just use socket.io with ports and chill.

[DoofusOfDeath]

I don't know if you inteded this, but in many contexts telling a person to "chill" is implicitly insulting.

You may find it distracts from whatever technical point you were trying to make.

[atrilumen]

Fair point. I'm just saying, maybe don't get too hung up on it. Just use ports and move on. I don't see why this is ever a big deal with Elm.

[eckza]

Right now, “Elm is Bad” is the new “Javascript is Bad”. It’ll blow over when it gets trendy to whine about something else.

[always_good]

It's a good demonstration of how nobody can resist a good lynch mob no matter how ridiculous the topic.

It's absolutely hilarious how Elm of all things was the #1 enemy of HN the last couple days. A language just about nobody uses (except me).

Yet suddenly everyone is just three degrees away from someone else who was irreparably wronged by Elm's creator. People coming out of the woodwork to show that they, too, are offended by such reprehensible behavior like removing a couple features from a programming language.

Web developers are literally the most oppressed people on the planet. This Evan guy messed with the wrong motherfuckers!

[eckza]

What's even MORE hilarious, to me, is how Elm was the #1 Best Thing Ever for about a week sometime last winter, which is why I got into it in the first place.

It's a great language. The community has been nothing but stellar to me - a complete novice at not just FP, but also JS and web in general.

The entitlement is unreal. "How DARE you create this great free thing, and have the AUDACITY to make it work the way you want it to?!"

[dfee]

On the contrary, I read the referenced post like: “keep Elm weird” as a play on “keep Austin weird” (Portland, etc.) and thus chill came across as more of a “Netflix and Chill” sort of “don’t worry about it”.

Someone’s always going to get bent out of shape (<— I expect I’m creating a demonstration of that right here) with language usage, but please don’t write like a computer when talking with humans so as to avoid these sorts of remarks.

[mlthoughts2018]

“chill” coming across as “Netflix and chill” would still be squarely in the offensive manner of its usage though — the presumption that the parent comment was too tightly wound or something, and thus needs to “chill” (relax in some capacity). It undercuts the parent comment.

It’s kind of like interrupting someone when they are trying to make a point that is important to them by saying, “hey, you’re having a bad hair day” and then acting like this shouldn’t impact the confidence they have in their point.

[boubiyeah]

"Just use javascript" to workaround the many language limitations then? :D

In that case, why not use typescript for everything? Being pure is nice and all but it's not a goal in itself, especially if the language is extremely limited as a result.

[vmchale]

Being pure is nice, and you don't have to compromise if you use GHCJS + Miso or PureScript + whatever.

[cies]

For the lazy (pun intended):

https://haskell-miso.org

https://github.com/dmjio/miso