[kgwgk]

Companies can also issue debt to pay dividends. The thing you are discussing is not about buybacks vs dividends (is about returning capital to shareholders by either of these mechanism vs not doing so).

> Apple had $0 long term debt in 2013. At the end of June 2018 they held $97B!!!

They also have much more than that in cash (and cash-equivalents). If you want to make a point about companies giving to shareholders money that they don’t really have Apple or Microsoft are not the best examples.