[barry-cotter]

If being proud of your culture and history doesn’t make you a nationalist what does? The fact that French and American nationalism are expressed differently doesn't mean the French aren’t nationalist. Irish nationalism is expressed to an amazing and annoying extent in hatred of the English. Flag waving is not the be all and end all of nationalism.

[watwut]

Being proud does not make you nationalist. The issue with flag waving is the association with expansive military actions, repression of minorities etc. As in, outside sport match situation (where anybody waves flag), flag waving people were and are usually pro expansion, quite hateful and fearful of other ethnic groups, authoritarian etc.

Likely the association in USA is different. But here, when I see flag in backyard, I would expect open or at least above average animosity toward tourist of wrong color. And also expect support for authoritarian anti democratic group.

[chimeracoder]

> The issue with flag waving is the association with expansive military actions, repression of minorities etc. As in, outside sport match situation (where anybody waves flag), flag waving people were and are usually pro expansion, quite hateful and fearful of other ethnic groups, authoritarian etc.

France has proven itself to be more than capable of that ugly side of nationalism, whether or not they are waving flags.

[watwut]

The point here is that when/if it turns ugly, perpetrators will wave flag. Hence association of open flag waving with "the ugly stuff is about to happen in the open and for real".

[chimeracoder]

> The point here is that when/if it turns ugly, perpetrators will wave flag.

It already is ugly, and in plain sight. That's my point: people who aren't themselves directly affected by it don't notice it or dismiss it because it doesn't look like the jingoistic, flag-waving nationalism that they think of, but that doesn't mean it's not there.