[endorphone]

I took Ambien for four months (the sort of period it should normally be used for...even that pushes the upper limit) after a very loud and public event kicked off by severe sleep deprivation and stress.

It worked wonderfully. I'd take it and lie down and quickly fade off to a sort of sleep. I say sort of because apparently it isn't really a sleep, and doesn't have all of the benefits of sleep, but it was far better than the narcolepsy I was experiencing.

I looked forward to taking Ambien because it made the sleep process so effortless and nice. I renewed prescriptions and would actually think ahead to the moment when I got to enjoy an Ambien.

Then my insurance stopped covering it. The price is quite low, but it was a flag to me that I should probably stop: The system had said that I'd hit the limit of what I should take.

So I stopped. That was it.

Never had sleep walking. No weird phone calls. No "Walrus". When I took one I always did it with the intention of sleep, and immediately preparing for sleep.

So that is my counterpoint, I suppose. Real sleep is far better, but as an actual sleep aid, especially in high stress, it...works. Should anyone abuse it for other purposes? Absolutely not. Should they try to use it for a high? No, of course not.

[gameswithgo]

If the drug has a non trivial chance of making you lose your mind, and no way to identify that it will do that without losing your mind, it might not be appropriate to ever use it, even if it works well for some people.

[nradov]

That's why we have doctors, to weigh the risks versus benefits and prescribe treatment in the patient's best interest.

I suspect that some of the worst side effects might have genetic risk factors. Hopefully researchers will determine whether people with particular genes are at greater risk of suffering mental problems from Ambien.

[codewithcheese]

I think doctors as a group of individuals have proven they can't be trusted to weigh the risks. Consider the opiods epidemic as an example

There must be better alternatives to get a good nights sleep.

OP description of " I renewed prescriptions and would actually think ahead to the moment when I got to enjoy an Ambien." sound a lot like early stage addiction.

[Nasrudith]

The one which the majority of addicts started from street users? Doctors seem to be the convenient scapegoat especially considering that ironically cracking down on pill mills has proven to be a 'we need bigger morgues' disaster with the iron law of prohibition resulting in fentanyl taking its place.

While pill mills aren't ideal clearly they were a form of harm reduction of sorts by ensuring very regularly measured doses - still possible to overdose of course but that is from upping it or taking it again too soon as opposed to having 'one dose' which is more like ten of the normal.

The absolute sickest part of it all is that despite this addicts can get more than enough painkillers yet the quixotic knee-jerk 'Do something! This is something lets do it!' crackdowns are hurting the actual chronic pain patients.

[nradov]

If we can't trust doctors then we have a much bigger problem that can't be solved by banning medicines which the FDA has determined to be safe and effective for treating certain conditions. While there's room for improvement in medical care standards, issues with a handful of drugs aren't sufficient evidence to provoke distrust. Most doctors get it right more often than wrong.

[boomboomsubban]

>Consider the opiods epidemic as an example

The one where drug companies actively lied about both how addictive their drugs were and the best way that they should be prescribed? Doctors aren't perfect, and there are some that are truly terrible, but in general their opinion is trustworthy.

[fhood]

I am hella addicted to amazon then. Holy shit.

[mikec3010]

Doctors did fine prescribing opioids in the 70s and 80s. They're not the cause of this epidemic.

[icantdrive55]

Yea--I'm not blaming doctors, nor drug companies.

Americans are misserable on so many levels. I believe most people who really liked opiates, are also very depressed.

Life in America, since the 80'-90's has been not great for many of us.

I'm not suprised people liked a drug that lifted the depression, and completely took away the anxiety.

[cortesoft]

So who should you trust to weigh risks? Every group that needs to weigh risks sometimes gets it wrong, that is what makes something a risk (uncertainty)

[TheSpiceIsLife]

Fairly sure the opioid epidemic isn't caused doctors sometimes getting it wrong.

[gameswithgo]

I am sure some doctors share the opinion that maybe we shouldn't ever use ambien.

[reverend_gonzo]

Alcohol has a non-trivial chance of making someone completely addicted to it, along with side effects that can ruin the lives of bystanders.

Does that mean no one should ever take alcohol as well?

The world is not black and white.

[codewithcheese]

Doctors should not prescribe alcohol. From a health and safety point of view, yes one should not consumer alcohol.

[xkcd-sucks]

Ethanol is the safest, cheapest, and best-studied intervention for acute methanol poisoning though

[yebyen]

I don't think this is relevant to the reason why most people are using ethanol, though... or most of the people using Ambien for that matter, at least is the impression I get from reading the discussion thread on this post!

[emodendroket]

From what I have read about Ambien I feel like the descent is much more sudden and unpredictable with the sleeping pills.

[gnulinux]

Ambien descent for me was absolutely momentary. One moment you feel normal, one moment later you feel absolutely different. For me it's even debatable if it ever makes you asleep. It feels more like it paralyzes you. I guess, I never had a "black out" from Ambien (like sleep walking etc) and the portions I remember were what I can describe as hell on earth.

[astura]

Ambien is a prescription medication; alcohol is a recreational drug.

[cortesoft]

Shouldn't that depend on how bad the disease is that you are trying to cure with the drug?

[erentz]

> I took Ambien for four months

Every night for four months? Yeah that is stretching it from everything I've read. I started using it off/on when I went through a period of insomnia almost a decade ago. The doctor was very strict that it was for not more than two-four weeks and that I should try to only use it every second night.

That insomnia passed, but I since used a half dose (5 mg) on average once every 7 days (that's the average but it's more like 2 or 3 nights every 2 or three weeks). I need it when traveling or during anything stressful going on at work. Nothing else works. In a new hotel room I can just lay there all night long unable to sleep because it's an unfamiliar environment. Or if I know I have to be up by a certain hour and give a presentation or have a possibly conflicting meeting the next day - no sleep.

I do wonder what the long term impacts of even this low intermittent usage is though. But the alternative is not working or traveling.

[DenisM]

You seem to have anxiety, that might be a better treatment target.

[sizzle]

Have you tried meditation and mindfulness? Curious if clearing your mind and relaxation techniques would allow you to combat the anxiety of being worried of not falling asleep? If not, why haven't you tried it?

[erentz]

I’ve tried it, I find in general regular exercise and relaxing yoga routines with some meditation before bed works in some situations. But doesn’t work for the new hotel or “big meeting next day” scenarios. I end up just meditating all night forcing the rehearsing thoughts out of my head and still not falling asleep until around 4am. It then becomes a performance thing, I know I want to have slept so I can perform so I go for what I know will 100% work.

For the sibling comment: I’ve also tried other general anxiety treatments - but they are all be pretty serious stuff you don’t want to use too much if you don’t have too. Since my anxiety seems limited to certain situations I find it best to use the minimum targeted just at those directly.

[qubex]

I looked forward to it — yes! Mine was abuse (see my other post further down in the thread if you’re interested) but it was so damned convenient to just flip a figurative switch and have the lights go out.

[lscore720]

Thanks for sharing your experience and articulating this so well.

I have been on the same dose of Ambien for nearly 2 years. I'm fortunate that it does its job with zero side effects. The negative experiences and feedback in this thread are overwhelming - if I were unfamiliar with it, I would be freaked out!

It's generally accepted that Ambien's benefits outweigh the costs. I don't mean to downplay the negative experiences, but it's not as bad as this article/thread infer. Ultimately, it's something to discuss with a GP or Psychiatrist.

[wnissen]

I take a half an Ambien to sleep on overnight flights, no side effects that I can discern. It's all about managing risks relative to benefits, and not always in an evenhanded way. 2 grams of Tylenol/paracetamol with a bottle of wine and it's bye bye, liver, yet you can buy it in a vending machine.

[pseingatl]

You might want to be careful with Ambien and airplanes.

A U.S. intelligence worker on a flight back to the U.S. from an assignment overseas tried to dynamite a plane while on Ambien.

Look up "Derek Stansberry": http://edition.cnn.com/2010/TRAVEL/04/28/disruptive.passenge...

[gnulinux]

Ok but that's a very odd comparison. It's well known and studied that _normal_ doses of Ambien can induce unpredictable behavior on humans including sleep walking and/or confusion. But 2 grams of paracetamol is 4 times the normal dose, and paired with a drug it should never ever be taken with.