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by akavel 2896 days ago
Personally, I actually never thought Dep was blessed by the Go team to the point that it "was going to be official". So I wouldn't be so fast to say "pretty much everyone". Notably, some loud people "thought" so; I've noticed that many quiet people quietly did not (as can be seen e.g. by the numerous voiced agreements and endorsements of the vgo prototype on the mailing list). Again, I personally expected exactly something similar to what was pulled off in the end to happen. Especially given that whenever somebody started claiming Dep "is going to be official", rsc/rob (don't remember) seemed fast to correct that it's not so, and that it's only an official experiment. Even Sam, after AFAIR being corrected so, was seemingly careful to say only about an official experiment in public emails, readme, etc.

I have numerous thoughts about developments like this one. Mostly, that I've seen a similar situation happen in numerous communities already, Go totally not being the first nor the last one, that the steering commitee have the last say, and may have different taste. I learnt to accept that their choice usually does have merit and usually actually ends for the better. I learnt that it requires a lot of humbleness and sometimes gritting one's teeth, learning to let go of hurt feelings, and accepting that someone else may have reasons you still need to grow to understand. Personally, my own view is that for Sam, this was probably the first time something like this happened, and he wasn't prepared for the hit. And I agree those never stop tasting bitter, given the work one has put in a project of this kind. A good will, hard contribution, being de facto rejected in the end. A child being "lost". But that's not the whole truth, because the child is in this case reborn, though in somewhat different shape. The experiment has served its purpose and brought a lot of value, a significant contribution. On the other hand, I do sometimes wonder, can such situations and misunderstandings be avoided somehow? Or is the world just not perfect enough? And by the way, I also think that Russ was actually taken by surprise by the extent of the reaction. I suppose that's why it took him so long to react, which let the situation and complains get somewhat louder than necessary.

But that's too just my personal opinion. One of many in this somewhat unfortunate situation. I just wanted to also let my steam off in the end, starting to grow more and more tired of the recurring claims that "everybody is surprised". On the contrary, I'm personally one of the people looking forward to vgo, and strongly unconvinced by what dep has become.

1 comments

What impression you had probably depends on whether you read the Go mailing lists or not. All of my colleagues, myself included, had gotten the impression, who knows how, that Dep was official. We don't follow the Go lists.

The Dep situation is very similar to that of Eric S. Raymond's attempt at replacing the Linux kernel's config tool. Instead of presenting a design proposal and discussing it in public, he pretty much finished the project on his own, perhaps thinking that a working version would lead to adoption by users and thus forcing the kernel team to accept something users liked. Or perhaps he assumed he had clout in the Linux community, which of course he didn't. Either way, this kind of brute-forcing just leads to wasted work and resentment.

That's a very interesting reply for me, thanks. Reflecting on it, actually I don't really follow the list either nowadays, due to not enough time. But I feel I kinda do know the “who's who” of the community, and thus I sometimes just glance through some threads (e.g. on HN) looking only for what did a core member of the Go team say. Recently, I repeatedly feel it's important to quickly find out who's the “important people with power” in an online tech forum. I don’t want this to sound as some kind of a critique; just trying to put down how I believe I came to the conclusion I expressed in the above comment, to try and better understand it for myself.