Hacker News new | ask | show | jobs
by Areading314 2915 days ago
This might work for slow moving teams with a few contributors, but I can't imagine using this in the way I've seen github used on projects with many contributors... Email just doesn't scale as well
3 comments

Since he mentions Linux as the primary example of a project that uses email, I think this particular criticism needs some refinement.
Linux is kind of special, only experienced developers contribute to it because working on a kernel is hard.

Most projects are more accessible to beginners, and GitHub makes it much easier for them to do their first contribution to an open source project.

Mesa is another large project using email for patch submission and review.
I'm sure plenty of Linux maintainers would much prefer using github if they could...
Here is an interesting post about the Linux project and why they don't use GitHub

https://blog.ffwll.ch/2017/08/github-why-cant-host-the-kerne...

Maybe! I'm also a skeptic—see my other comment. But just saying "it can't work" is untenable.
> Using email for git scales extremely well. The canonical project, of course, is the Linux kernel. A change is made to the Linux kernel an average of 7 times per hour, constantly.

Tell that to any big team in a big company or even a medium-sized company using a monorepo. The Linux project has a very high bar for entry and it's not an example of a busy repo.

Linux upstream gets 7 commits per hour, but the Linux project is divided into subsystems which are run like independent projects that periodically push their work upstream. The volume of activity that Linux receives is very high.

Can you back up your statements with evidence? I have no reason to believe that email wouldn't work in a large monorepo-like setting. The less-than-10-in-total companies which have crazy Google-tier monorepos may run into issues with this (honestly, though, I doubt it), but they are not the norm.

Can you explain why email doesn’t scale?

Do you mean the protocols, the clients, the servers, or something else?

Having to sort through messages individually, not being able to browse code, no convenient links, no formatting, no branch visualizations, release notes being easily accessible, having to set up a bunch of fragile text based filters. It's just obviously a worse choice
> Having to sort through messages individually

Your email reader is supposed to help you read and reply to message threads.

> not being able to browse code

You browse code by doing a git clone/checkout, and then using your regular programming tools.

> no convenient links

Your email client should help you navigate and search message threads. Here is one of many that helps you do this: http://www.djcbsoftware.nl/code/mu/mu4e.html

> no formatting

This is what you editor is supposed to do.

> no branch visualizations

This is what tools like magit are supposed to do: https://magit.vc/

> release notes being easily accessible

They go in a text file in the repository. You open the text file with your editor. Your editor should also help you write release notes: https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Ch...

> having to set up a bunch of fragile text based filters.

Why?

I see arguments like yours about email and git a lot. Why do you think people disagree with you? You have to pay attention to what you are really saying. You are not listing advantages of web-based git interfaces. You are listing "disadvantages" of existing tools. And all of the "disadvantages" you list are really areas where you do not understand how to use Unix programming tools effectively. Getting off of webmail and onto a good text-based email client is one of the best things you can do as a computer user.

Or rather --- the age of text-based email clients has really come and gone. The world has moved on. Web or GUI based PRs are accessible to all developers of many different levels and experiences, that is why they have (and will continue to) be the winners.
Once again, an opinion from someone who does not know how to use the tools effectively. The world has moved on, and left web-based email clients behind. If you haven't checked out what modern text-based email clients and IMAP syncing tools can do, you are really missing out. I switched from Gnus to Gmail in 2006, and switched from Gmail to mu4e/offlineimap last year. The comparison is not even close; mu4e/offlineimap is an overwhelmingly superior solution.
Negative. An opinion from someone who finds the value in GUIs despite knowing about the alternatives. Use what makes you productive, but for MOST people, that is going to be a well done GUI over a text based solution. For me, I don't want to spend time configuring or fixing my email solution, I just want to login, get/read/reply to my email, and move on to real work. Don't confuse your opinion with what is "best" or "most effective" for most people, even developers and those ultra-familiar with the terminal.
I don't think the intent is to do code review from email. The idea would be to send the merge request through email, which is then imported into your local git as a branch. Then you're able to do review/analysis/etc with whichever git tooling you prefer.
You can still use a bug tracker with an email-based workflow. Many GNU projects use debbugs.gnu.org, which helps to keep track of patches that have been sent to the mailing list.

I can see how it would be inconvenient for people who use an inflexible email client or editor, though. (I'm trying to make this workflow a little less intimidating for Guix by working on a more convenient web interface on top of debbugs.)

Have you tried it to see if it's actually as bad as you think?
I guess the question would be, what compelling reason would there be to do so? To me, the article's advantages are kinda meh, and I much prefer the tools provided in code review packages.
If you knew one whit about what you’re talking about you’d feel pretty silly about this comment.
You may be right, but this comment breaks the site guidelines by being uncivil and unsubstantive. That's not a good way to be right on HN. Better is to politely provide necessary corrective information, so then the rest of us can learn something.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html