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by pacnard 2920 days ago
Nytimes complains about suicides, but then it also promote policies and politicians that are causing the suicides and destroying our socities. Some of the policies are: uncontrolled immigration from poor countries bringing crime and causing social distrust. Laws that close the market and give few companies a lot of bargaining power, forcing people to move around like cattle and also making almost impossible to create good economies in towns. Laws that give sociopaths the ability to bring functioning human being in courts for stupid reasons and win, making people not trusting their neighbors. Divorce laws that destroy families. Anti-family propaganda that pushes people to destroy their family at the first difficulties. These things, and many others, make really difficult to create a well-connected society, and people eventually kill themselves because it's really bad out there where you get a little off the track set by thr State and its puppetters.

So, nytimes should know very well that this is not an existential crisis, it's the result of something they supported for a very long time.

4 comments

> uncontrolled immigration from poor countries bringing crime and causing social distrust

This is not a thing that exists. First, immigration into the US, from poor countries or otherwise is not uncontrolled by any stretch of the imagination. Notably, immigration rates are far far from their historical heights. Second, bringing crime is a bold-face lie: immigrants commit crimes both petty and violent at lower rates than native born Americans. And, of course, crime rates are also at or near historical lows no matter what stat one looks at. Third, "social distrust" is pretty odd thing to try to pin on immigration: while there is some research that indicates that a non-assimilated minority undermines social trust, the US as a whole certainly doesn't have a migration rate of non-assimilated minorities at anywhere close to those rates, those migration rates have not increased, and the demographic "Bowling Alone" type studies indicate that the non-dynamic communities where immigrants aren't settling are the ones having issues.

As for "people moving around like cattle", internal migration rates (people moving out of state/county) have fallen steadily over the last thirty years or so. And since when is the movement of people towards opportunity a bad thing? What if towns in which it's "impossible to create good economies" have simply outlived their usefulness as going concerns?

Predictably, this comment rules out moving to opportunity or a social safety net or investment (collective action to solve problems such as "few companies [with] a lot of bargaining power" is spooky) and believes that a well-connected society can only happen when "good economies in towns" are first brought into being by magic as opposed to anything that can actually work.

And, of course, the NYTimes isn't doing all that much to promote policies or politicians aiming to "destroy socities [sic]". Come on now.

> uncontrolled immigration from poor countries bringing crime and causing social distrust.

That's bullshit, sorry. Given same demographics, refugees bring about the same levels of crime as "native Germans" do (e.g. https://www.zeit.de/gesellschaft/zeitgeschehen/2016-06/bunde...). The "rise" that is sometimes perceived is largely based on the fact that young, poor-ish males tend to be the social group with the most crime issues.

As for "social distrust", you are certainly correct in the symptom, but not the cause. The cause is not "uncontrolled immigration", but politicians having totally screwed up social security systems and protection laws. For example, fair and equal minimum wage laws and especially actual enforcement of these would prevent the common notion of "the migrants are taking away our jobs because they're cheaper".

> Laws that give sociopaths the ability to bring functioning human being in courts for stupid reasons and win, making people not trusting their neighbors.

Laws usually have a reason why they got enacted. Yeah, it's sometimes a mess (especially when it comes to HOAs, per countless debates here and on reddit), but in general, stuff is pretty okay.

> Divorce laws that destroy families.

Care to explain how, other than (in the US!) everything being on the public record and snatched up on the Internet for everyone to see?

> Anti-family propaganda that pushes people to destroy their family at the first difficulties.

What? And even if that were true: sorry, but a family/environment where there is constant arguing between the parents is not healthy for the kids!

> That's bullshit, sorry. Given same demographics

Wait a minute....if you're calling bullshit, why do you lead your disproof with a limiting qualifier?

Does the specific immigration the grandparent comment references arrive with the same demographics, or not?

> As for "social distrust", you are certainly correct in the symptom, but not the cause. The cause is not "uncontrolled immigration", but politicians having totally screwed up social security systems and protection laws. For example, fair and equal minimum wage laws and especially actual enforcement of these would prevent the common notion of "the migrants are taking away our jobs because they're cheaper".

Again, I would ask, is this a theory or is it a fact? I'm under the impression that social distrust rises as diversity rises (the underlying reason, and whether it is fact-based or not is irrelevant) - is this belief false?

I actually kind of don't agree with your last two points either, but those are more opinion-based so fairly pointless to argue one way or the other.

-1 with no response.

ideology > facts

I upvoted and largely agree with your comment. I place this reply as a memoriam, because your post will downvoted early and often.
Show me a person who killed themselves because of immigration and I'll show you a person who didn't receive proper mental healthcare.