[IanDrake]

Just curious if you’ve ever worked in a union job?

I have and my experience was that you will never get paid what you’re worth - if you’re talented.

So if you want to argue that people with less talent can make more money with unions, I would agree... in the short run.

Eventually talent will seek other means and leave the unionized industries. The brain drain will have two negative results, reduced overall productivity and a union demanding more and more for its members who produce less and less.

Ultimately, the company produces worse product and recieves less revenue. Less money to pay the hungry union members who demand even more.

Finally the company says fuck this and moves its production to another country where people will work harder for less.

The whole thing will be blamed on corporate greed and will be used as a rallying call to socialism. ‘Cause that’ll fix it.

[tptacek]

Just curious, have you ever worked in a non-union job?

I have and my experience was that you will never get paid what you're worth --- unless you're ruthless and prioritize gaming review systems over working with your team.

So if you want to argue that people who work exclusively to maximize their short-term outcomes without developing skills or, for that matter, any actual software can make more money without unions, I would agree... in the short run.

Am I fairly characterizing corporate jobs? About as fairly as you're characterizing collective bargaining, is what I think.

[IanDrake]

I take it that’s a no for you.

I’ve only ever had one union job (at a young age) and that told me everything I need to know about unions.

Ultimately if you’re not getting paid what you’re worth, that’s on you. Or you’re wrong about what you’re worth.

I guess our difference is that I’d rather myself to blame for poor negotiating than some union boss, making twice what I make, telling me what I’ll be getting with no ability to negotiate.

[tptacek]

"I’ve only ever had one union job (at a young age) and that told me everything I need to know about unions" pretty nicely sums this unproductive subthread up, doesn't it?

[IanDrake]

And you’ve never had one, ever.

So mock my limited, yet actual, experience while you arm chair philosophize about how many people unions have helped in your imagination.