Ask HN: Has anyone bootstrapped a business using services like Upworks?

[elephant0xffff]

I would like to go into consulting in a specific niche, but lack clients (currently working as software developer in a company).

There are related job offers at services like Upworks, where I could think make ~5000$/month (of course only if i get the jobs) which would be a lot of money in my current situation. However I read many horror-stories about Upworks, Toptal, Freelancer.com and related services, so I am hesitating.

Obviously I want to expand my field to direct customer interaction in the future, but short time it might be a decent idea?

Thank you for your insights and sry for my bad English, HN.

[DoreenMichele]

I'm not a developer. I'm a writer.

I started to write a long-ish answer here, then decided to make it a blog post:

http://digitalmicroenterprise.blogspot.com/2018/05/starting-...

Best.

[elephant0xffff]

Hey Doreen, thanks for your input. By "service" you mean some of the popular middlemen mentioned in this thread? All the best for your endeavor!

[DoreenMichele]

Yes, a middleman. One of these services:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JfNAbUX_lN9K3MCNHO15...

[usgroup]

I don’t know where you are but typically you’re better of contracting.

The typical situation is that employers need techies LOCALLY and can’t find them in the sort of numbers they’d ideally want which drives rates up: +1 techie.

Issue with freelancing sites is that it flips the demand/supply around. The supply is global and outstrips demand (ie people actually compete for contracts): rates are driven down, +1 employer

IMO:

1. Try and contract locally if the pay is best there. Further you’ll be creating contacts to get you into new gigs.

2. If that’s not available look for remote positions direct with employers. If you’re v good you might get one.

3. If you can’t do that consider a freelancing site but really all it’ll be good for is portfolio . You’ll probably find the “next step” remains just as far away if you already have s portfolio.

[elephant0xffff]

> The typical situation is that employers need techies LOCALLY and can’t find them in the sort of numbers they’d ideally want which drives rates up: +1 techie.

There are local jobs here, but they are mostly pretty standard and boring (small business web sites and marketing), which I am not really interested to do.

Although there is a lot of competition on freelancer.com et al. at least there are jobs for most areas of expertise.

As mentioned, I am aware of the drawbacks (pay-cut by middleman, competition with a large pool of other workers), but it seems like a good idea to find your first clients.

Hopefully it is not bad reputation later on (this guy worked at Upworks) ...

[timojaask]

I've also heard of good and bad stories about Upwork. I think it all depends on how you handle it yourself.

One of my good friends started his copywriting career on Upwork. First projects he did were extremely cheap, just getting some experience. However, he made sure he does the absolute best he can, with every project. So clients were happy and recommended him to other clients. My friend would be doubling his hourly rate pretty frequenly, and eventually stopped using Upwork altogether, because clients would contact him directly, by reference from his previous clients.

On the other hand, I know a person who's been copywriting on Upwork for seven years, and still has an hourly rate of 10 USD / hour, which is just ridiculous.

[elephant0xffff]

Thanks, this is uplifting information, and sounds like a good plan - start with low-paying jobs and be exceptional and then raise your rates and get first-hand clients.

How professional do they handle freelancer's and client's privacy? I will try to do my best but some things can and will go wrong. If things don't go well I don't want to loose my reputation because of some remote-work jobs site, because they or a client skrewed up.

[timojaask]

I don't personally know enough about Upwork to answer that question.

I'm currently working as a developer consultant, and get all my clients from my previous work history. I used to work in an agency, building apps for many different clients, so now I've got a lot of connections in the industry.

[elephant0xffff]

Has it been complex to sell your skills because of your previous employee? Did you just cold e-mail your previous contacts that you got while working or did they approach you?

[staticautomatic]

What is your specific privacy concern? That something bad will happen and everyone on the internet will see that you were involved?

[staticautomatic]

I've hired a lot via UpWork and consider it the lesser of evils among these platforms. It is still all kinds of evil, though. I've heard it's at least as bad for the contractors.

[Gustomaximus]

I tend to hire off Freelancer. I haven't seen too much difference in people found. It seems more in the way of how you filter people as there is a bunch of poor performers.

I find Upwork seems to give people high summary ratings and when you look at their history and there is a bunch of bad reviews. There is something dodgy going on there which is a main reason I flipped to Freelancer. That and I thought it was good to support a company from my country.

[staticautomatic]

The one or two times I've used Freelancer, the quality of the candidates was quite poor (at least what I was hiring for). But what really annoyed me was how conspicuously Freelancer nickle-and-dimes on fees for various things just to post the job.

[elephant0xffff]

After evaluating both platforms in more detail I will probably start with freelancer.com as it is possible to have an arbitrary name (e.g. "elephantdesign") instead of real name only. This makes it simpler to tailor your profile to a specific niche in my opinion and seems more privacy aware. Obviously both platforms are pretty intrusive, but at least freelancer.com guard your real name.

However there seems to be an agency mode on Upworks which might be similar.

[staticautomatic]

I may be alone in this but as the one doing the hiring I strongly prefer individual freelancers who use their real names. Fraud is a very real problem on these platforms.