[mfer]

Helm and Community Charts maintainer here...

Helm is a package manager. Think of it like apt for Kubernetes.

Operators enable you to manage the operation of applications within Kubernetes.

They are complementary. You can deploy an operator as part of a Helm Chart. I recently wrote a blog post that explains how the different tools relate. https://codeengineered.com/blog/2018/kubernetes-helm-related...

[nikolay]

Any plans to switch from templatized YAML to Jsonnet/Ksonnet?

[bryanlarsen]

The helm 3 proposal uses Lua. Not sure if they've actually started working on it: https://github.com/kubernetes-helm/community/blob/master/hel...

[nikolay]

Honestly, this is a terrible choice! I like Lua, but it's not mainstream, and it's not going to be! There are tons of embeddable JavaScript engines - they could've used TypeScript, too!

[mfer]

Let me try to add a little color here.

Lua support is NOT being added for templating. It's being added to enable extensions in charts (a new thing) and for cross platform plugins. Existing style plugins will still work. This is providing some extras to help enable more cross platform work.

There are a couple reasons Lua was chosen and documentation has been written up as well.

1. There are go packages for this so we can do it in a cross platform manner (mac/win/linux/bsd/etc). Helm is used on many platforms. 2. Security issues, especially with extensions to charts, have a path forward to address. In a similar way to how we opt-in for apps to use features on cell phones we can do that for features used in extensions.

The people who did the analysis has embedded JS engines in applications recently. They are aware of the benefits, pitfalls, and how it all works.

[hobofan]

> but it's not mainstream, and it's not going to be!

Why are you suggesting jsonnet then?

[nikolay]

Because it's popular in Kubernetes and makes sense, unlike Lua in the context.

[mfer]

> Any plans to switch from templatized YAML to Jsonnet/Ksonnet?

Not exactly. Two things to know...

First, a little history.

Only a tiny amount of people have asked for it. A prototype was created and no one, not even the ksonnet devs, were up for taking the work forward from the prototype phase. The code is still up on GitHub and Helm was built with the intent of more engines being used.

Second, ksonnet is going through some major changes right now. We can all come back and look on it again when it's ready.

Helm 3 is working to make it easier to bring your own tools, like jsonnet. It's just not likely to be baked in or replace YAML. People really aren't asking for it much.

[nikolay]

Ksonnet might be under active development, but Jsonnet is stable. YAML + Jinja2 is a dirty workaround - you can't even guarantee valid YAML with it as to Jinja2, everything's just text unlike with Jsonnet.