[shaklee3]

Nobody is arguing Google is the best at AI. You are arguing that translates to Google is the best at making chips. They aren't, and there's no evidence they are. Tensorflow is open source, and Nvidia contributes. Would you be willing to place a bet that more people run tensorflow on tpu or GPU?

Edit: and there are FAR more cuda users in general than tensorflow if you're trying to compare apples and oranges.

[jacksmith21006]

Well we have a data point that suggests they created a better chip. But just makes sense as they do the entire stack and that gives you the info they need to build a better chip.

Look a capsule networks and dynamic routing. That potentially drives a different architecture and Google has thousands of production models to use to optimize that Nvidia just does not have.

Plus it is one company so no IP issues.

But the biggy is we can see half the cost.

[shaklee3]

No, you have a data point that says they created a chip that performed better on a single test for a single domain of work. You also have a data point that says tpu can't do any 64-bit simulations. It's not half the cost. See previous comment. It's about 100x the cost after 51 days.

[jacksmith21006]

Find the questioning on the entire stack just baffling with Google.

People - Google has the strongest team of AI experts in the industry by a wide margin. At NIPS this year Google had more papers excepted than anyone else. The big AI breakthroughs come from Google. They solved Go a decade earlier than anyone thought possible. Would put FB #2 with AI experts but a very distant #2.

Google miles ahead with SDC.

Plus Google is able to attract the top talent better than anyone else.

https://unsupervisedmethods.com/nips-accepted-papers-stats-2....

Applications - Search, Photos, Speech, AlphaZero, Self Driving Cars, Google now has over 4k NN in production. Nobody else even in the ball park. Hand down the leader in applications.

Infrastructure - Tensor Flow now has 98k stars on GitHub. It is the canonical AI framework in the industry and really nothing else close. CNTK is #2 with 14k stars. But Google ads about 7x per days stars.

https://github.com/tensorflow/tensorflow

Then there is Google cloud infrastructure and their other engineering talents which are well ahead of anyone.

I can go on but this is so incredibly silly. There is little question that Google is leading at every layer of the AI stack by a wide margin.

This is so silly I suspect something else going on here. We do not seem to be discussing things based on reality.

Is this about Damore?

BTW, Nvidia can only spin up what they know about. Google does not share everything but luckily they do a lot for Nvidia.

In 2018 you just have to run the infrastructure to be long term viable in the chip game.

[jacksmith21006]

Well do you have any test or seen any that indicates otherwise?

What we have here is same work and half the cost. Which makes sense as Google does all the layers of the stack and is just has a fundmental advantage to better optimize.

AI it is even more important.

[jacksmith21006]

Also have no idea what 100x the cost refers to. We can see half the cost.

[shaklee3]

This isn't worth going on about anymore. If you can't the cost of running a GPU in your own server versus the TPU in the cloud, then I'm not going to help you.

[jacksmith21006]

The last thing you want is to buy your own hardware. You use the cloud as you then actually use what you need.

Google creating their own silicon which is far cheaper for them to run gets you 1/2 the cost of using Nvidia. Seems like an easy decision.

Help me? Seems like you are trying to hurt me? Just curious what drives it? Does not seem rational but driven my some emotion?