[9oliYQjP]

He wasn't out of a job. He was working at Microsoft and was shopping around. I suppose there is nothing I can do to convince you otherwise. All I can say is speak to really good programmers, and by that I mean people that can 1) code 2) not only communicate with people but communicate effectively and lead groups, and 3) understand the bigger picture and how their work fits into it. They can move from attractive job to attractive job the way a hot Hollywood celebrity can move from attractive partner to attractive partner. Personally, I'm jealous :)

[vesterr]

"and lead groups"

What does that have to do with programming? A lot of programmers find the notion of management extremely distasteful. ;)

"They can move from attractive job to attractive job"

Then I guess they keep ending up in jobs that weren't what they really wanted to do after all!

[9oliYQjP]

Programming has a lot to do with people. People influenced the choice of languages, file formats, applications, and operating systems you use more than their technical merit on its own. The ability to convey technical merit and convince others of your message is crucial to being an effective programmer and is very much what leadership is. I've seen the smartest most capable programmers become dejected and rather useless because they lack these qualities. They end up working on the insignificant problems and surprise-surprise are miserable because of it.

These people usually like to make excuses, and refer to the Dilbert PHB effect as the root cause of the problem. That's a very cynical way to view the workplace. Although, Dilbert is quite funny I'll give it that. The Dilbert-style programmer is going the way of the do-do. It used to be that a programmer could be an asshole of a person and have no communication skills, because so few people understood computers. The market simply had to put up with these people. Circumstances have changed. There are people with great personalities that have compelling leadership traits that know how to program these days and they are finding the best jobs and exerting the greatest influence on the industry.

On another note, what makes you think that jobs are static experiences? Working at Google in 2001 would be far different from working there today in 2008. Good people move on from jobs because they out-grow them, the same way people move on from friendships but might never have had a falling out with the other people in those relationships.

Cheers, we'll just agree to disagree!

[vesterr]

"Cheers, we'll just agree to disagree!"

Sorry, you don't get to pre-empt all further discussion after saying what you want to say. :)

"Programming has a lot to do with people"

Everything people do has a lot to do with people.

"and convince others of your message is crucial to being an effective programmer and is very much what leadership is."

Once again, you are conflating leadership with programming. Two separate things. You can be good at either without being good at the other.

If you are working with other good programmers then they should be able to tell whether your design has the most technical merit, or whether some other design does. If you're politicking then the code is going to suffer.

"It used to be that a programmer could be an asshole of a person and have no communication skills"

I think that's a majorly incorrect stereotype. People with no communication skills tend to have social phobia. They are shy, not assholes. The assholes are the "Rockstar" types and the people who think they are amazing leaders. They like to communicate their perceived superiority to other people.

"Good people move on from jobs because they out-grow them"

Good point.