[shafyy]

I always ask this for "x in crypto", and I'll ask it again: What important problem are you solving with this? Or, put differently: Why is this significantly (i.e. 10x) better than existing solutions?

PS: If my stance is not clear from my comment: I think most crypto-based startups are not solving a real problem, just adding crypto to an existing problem.

[yuvalr1]

The sole problem crypto currency solves is the problem of centralization. Regarding the Airbnb case, why would people want to pay the Airbnb commission when they can have direct payment and bookkeeping using the blockchain?

Of course there are still the (important) issues of disputes, insurance etc. that are provided by the centralized entity. These might be solved in the future and might be not.

[adventured]

In the absence of a central host, who is hosting the media? In the near future that's likely to include advances around AR/VR, which will significantly increase the burden on infrastructure.

Who provides a trusted system of reviews? Who hosts/controls those? What's the basis of trusting those to be legitimate users/customers? Who foots the bill for the site (or similar) that enables organized browsing of all listings, searching, information presentation, et al.? How do you force coordination on that if it's decentralized? How do you then keep that decision committee from becoming the central authority all over again? This is the libertarian anarchy problem, where you will always end up right back with some center power structure that becomes dominate.

There are a vast number of problems that Airbnb solves that you're leaving out.

There is no scenario where decentralized wins. The extreme majority of users do not care about decentralization, it is meaningless to them. They want a trusted central authority to hold responsible, complain to, sue, whatever.

[janoc]

What's even worse, even the payment issue is solved and nobody is forced to go through Airbnb for that.

There is Paypal, Moneygram, Western Union, there are direct wire transfers, in many countries you can pay by cheque, you can do a direct deposit ... And all of these work with your existing cash and credit cards and don't require knowledge how to set up a Bitcoin (or whatever-coin) wallet and how to use it and how not to get scammed.

It is literally a solution looking for a problem hoping to cash on the crypto craze (adding -coin to anything is a sure way to get funded/bought/have your stock price soar up).

[usrusr]

Roaming between "regional ubers" might be such a thing, where the day to day business runs centrally within each regional system, but profile access and payment forwarding for roaming is "cryptoed". I don't really see why that would absolutely need a full blockchain though, as there are only so many things you could meaningfully cosign with three parties involved (assuming drivers don't roam). Bbut maybe I missed something that would need getting written into a public blockchain, maybe for establishing the required trust network between providers.

But this would have to come into existence with all the lack of glamour as any dry old industry standard, the whole scenario contains absolutely no room for a starry-eyed "Uber on blockchain!" startup (which are doubtlessly legion).

[joejerryronnie]

Ah, but the libertarian anarchy solution is to wait until the dominant central power structure is your group and then declare all problems solved and fight vigorously for the status quo.

[jasonlaramburu]

Governments also prefer having a trusted ‘central’ authority to sue and censor. This way they can force ‘illegal’ listings off the platform.

[thisisit]

> why would people want to pay the Airbnb commission when they can have direct payment and bookkeeping using the blockchain?

Well, how is that possible when this page says?

https://www.cryptocribs.com/whyhost

CryptoCribs handles all the crypto payments for you. All we need is your public BTC and ETH address

And I doubt there are no commissions involved for handling payments.

[healsjnr1]

I think there is potential for using smart contracts for traditional agent based hotel bookings. Settlement of these booking between the agent (ie., booking.com) and the hotelier is a messy and complicated process. It varies from invoicing or manual transfer, to generating virtual credit cards and emailing them to the front desk.

Using a contract to do this actually makes a lot of sense and could limit breakage (where the supplier doesn't or can't charge the agent for the booking).

My main concern about this (which isn't addressed anywhere in the white paper) is privacy. If this is done poorly, you are effectively linking accounts on a public ledger with real world locations and dates. Not only that, the guest and the host know a lot about the financial state of each.

[TheSpiceIsLife]

Is there any reason such a smart contract / blockchain would need to be public?

[Vinnl]

Doesn't Airbnb already solve that problem? (Without a blockchain.)

[jstanley]

You don't need to be solving something that the unwashed masses consider an "important problem". If you have a product, and people want to pay you for it, then that's a viable business.

FWIW, I am staying in a flat sourced through cryptocribs later this year, and looking forward to it.

If you want to pay with a debit card, you can use AirBnB. If you want to pay with Bitcoin, you can use cryptocribs.

[shafyy]

But if people are paying you for something, you're generally solving a problem for them, right?

Or why don't you convert your crypto to fiat and do Airbnb?

I am just challenging that enough people consider fiat currency such a pain in the ass that they will leave Airbnb and flock to Cryptocribs (even considering they would have the quality, quantity, and trust of Airbnb someday). An "average" person sees the BTC price of 0.0009 per night and doesn't even know what value that in their base currency. Of course, if it becomes normal to pay with BTC than it would work.

[jstanley]

> I am just challenging that enough people consider fiat currency such a pain in the ass that they will leave Airbnb and flock to Cryptocribs

And I'm contending that this doesn't have to happen.

Cryptocribs doesn't need to take over the entire market for it to be a worthwhile endeavour for its creator or users.

> Or why don't you convert your crypto to fiat and do Airbnb?

When you pay using a debit card in person, why don't you withdraw cash from an ATM and then pay with cash?

[shafyy]

> Cryptocribs doesn't need to take over the entire market for it to be a worthwhile endeavour for its creator or users.

I agree it doesn't. But if they want to build a sustainable business, they'll need a critical mass. Maybe it's possible to achieve that mass with this model

> When you pay using a debit card in person, why don't you withdraw cash from an ATM and then pay with cash?

That's not a good analogy. If I need to buy a product and they don't accept debit cards, that's precisely what I do.

Consider this hypothetical scenario. A person has BTC and dollars. She needs to book an apartment for her holiday in Barcelona. If the better (regarding quality, price, trust, availability, location, etc.) is on Airbnb, do you think she would book an inferior offer just because she can pay with BTC?

Just to be clear: I'm not trying to bash Cryptocribs. I think it's fantastic that people are creating new stuff and challenging incumbents. I am not a crypto expert, but I do have some experience in building startups. I am just trying to pose challenging questions and get a discussion going. Because, who am I to know if this model or that model will work out in the future. All we can do is try to ask the right questions :-)

[jstanley]

I think looking at this through the lens of building startups is why your judgment of it is different to mine.

I agree with everything you've said, in the context of startups, but I think this is just a one-man side project. If it makes any money at all, it's a winner.

[Delta0]

not everything needs to be on the blockchain. we are thinking about putting only the most crucial touchpoints of flatsharing on chain, such as reputation and trust data. but immutability is not necessarily desired for some of this data either (even if it's just an IPFS that's put on chain). we're still actively thinking through this. also, it's not just about the ability to pay with crypto obviously, although that leverages the core stength of the technology. We take a small fee in the beginning which goes to 0 after a few bookings. Compare that to the 20% fees on Airbnb. Also, we don't censor messages between the guest and hosts, so if someone wants to pay directly they always can. We stand for giving users as much freedom as possible

[Delta0]

*IPFS hash

[enz]

It solves problems for Parisian hosts.

[michel__]

They slap a 'but you can pay in BTC' to it and call it revolutionary.

No, it won't be revolutionary when AirBnB starts accepting cryptocurrency. In fact, it'll fold immediately.

[Delta0]

it's not just about the ability to pay in crypto obviously. We take a small fee in the beginning which goes to 0 after a few bookings. Compare that to the 20% fees on Airbnb. Also, we don't censor messages between the guest and hosts, so if someone wants to pay directly they always can. We stand for giving users as much freedom as possible

[wils1245]

What if someone wrecks my house?

[Delta0]

we have a collaboration with slice.is, where you can get a $2m insurance, which is (i) an actual insurance and (ii) provides better coverage than any platform