[SomeStupidPoint]

> They have relatives, friends, aesthetic preferences, social obligations, religious beliefs, and other things that "do not compute" in mathematical models.

They compute fine -- most models are just "lying with math" by excluding the value of those things from their calculations.

It's not different than a friend who ignores those things when using words -- of course it doesn't make sense why you don't move if you don't account for the full value of where you are at present.

I think if we accounted for the destroyed social value that most of these economic models have inflicted, it would be the obvious massive negative that most people anecdotally tell. I think it's very telling how rarely you see these kinds of things modeled in economic theory despite how obviously part of the way humans value things they are.

Economics is merely institutionalized fixation on money, and produces precisely the psychopathic models you'd expect from that.

[abalashov]

Well, fair enough. Either way, the effect is the same — those variables are excluded from discussions in an almost sociopathic way.

[SomeStupidPoint]

I agree, but poking holes in why they're excluded is important, because it let's you have this exchange --

"You can't argue with the math!"

"Well, hold on now, I think you left a whole bunch of things out!"

If you don't know where the problem in the math is, despite there being an extremely obvious problem, many people will ignore your objections. That's why they use math, to paper over their obviously poor behavior.

Being able to strip that bare is useful.

[abalashov]

Aye.

It seems to me we'd do better taking an empirical approach and pricing in widespread psychological realities.

For instance, it's clear that one of the things people don't do very well with, especially as they head into middle age and beyond, is big downward adjustments in lifestyle. It just doesn't accord with the expectation of upward mobility and progression through life anywhere, least of all in the land of the American Dream.

So, even when economic circumstances get worse, their spending tends to remain stubbornly high relative to the quantitative reality. It seems to me sanctimoniously chiding people for that is not a constructive response. It's clearly what most people do, in some measure. The question is how to best deal with that systemically, if in any way at all.