[rauljara]

What Manjoo wishes Steve jobs would have said: 'He could have admitted a problem, offered a fix, and said, "We're sorry for any trouble we caused you."'

What Jobs said: 'To our customers who are affected by the issue, we are deeply sorry, and we are going to give you a free case or a full refund.'

Granted, Jobs only said that in response to his question, and not as part of his initial presentation. And Manjoo's critique of the dropped call statistic sounds dead on to me. But Manjoo specifically said what he would like out of the conference (even before this article), Jobs gave it to him, and he still is acting like Jobs personally punched him in the face.

[Natsu]

It's interesting what people get out of this.

Some see the tests where the other cell phones are shown to have a problem if you wrap your entire hand around it and point out that it's nothing like the little spot you just have to touch to make an iPhone die if you're less than 20-something dB above the minimum signal.

Others see the apology you quoted and don't understand the media witch hunt, where the press even supports those who traffic in stolen phones.

(I realize that I'm oversimplifying both of those stories a bit, but they're not my main point.)

Seems like there's no middle ground any more. If you post something in support of them, you'll be derided by someone as a fanboy. If you post something against them, you'll be derided as a hater. Whichever one you pick, you'll likely stay there, because both sides feel free to act like jerks toward the other. And why would you want to switch and side with those jerks who were mean to you?

I try to remain neutral, but it's hard. I see some people giving them a free pass, and I dislike it. But other people do give them flack when it's unfair. I don't want to do either. I want to be fair.

In short, maybe what we really need here is more civility?

[dieterrams]

I'm an Apple fan who doesn't get the witch hunt, but I readily acknowledge Jobs glossed over the problem. The problem is that the problem ultimately wasn't much of a problem to begin with, but the haters keep looking for something to get angry about. I can't go a day on Hacker News without seeing several grossly uncharitable comments get a bunch of upvotes. Any other topic, and it'd get rightly voted down. It's extremely poor form for Hacker News, and it's started to make me pretty bitter. In fact, the only reason why I created an account was to fight back against the hate/FUD.

I believe that there are a number of strong, charitable, level-headed criticisms you can make about Apple. I don't have a problem with those, and appreciate it when people make them. But that's not what we're getting here. What we're getting is a bunch of snippy and sneering quips from people who don't bother to examine the range of possible reasons why Apple did X, instead always assuming that they did X just to be manipulative jerks. It's just crazy.

I like Hacker News a lot, but this has really been souring the experience.

Edit: And look at how I get anonymously downvoted. These guys can't even argue in their defense. They just maliciously downvote.

[dieterrams]

I get the impression that a lot of people wouldn't have been satisfied with anything less than Jobs admitting that the iPhone 4 has been a total disaster, getting down on his knees begging forgiveness for Apple's success, and tearfully crying out "My life is a sham!" before committing seppuku.

[glhaynes]

I've been interested to read people's responses to the press conference. Those who have taken a contrarian view have often mentioned it as though it were fact that Jobs didn't admit that it was a "real problem". I, on the other hand, was struck by how often Steve used the word "problem" rather than the lighter "issue".