[FlyingSnake]

> Because the science and engineering cultures of computing have failed to address these effectively

That doesn't automatically make coders 'Artists'. There is a huge gamut of software outside the CRUD world of HN. Software that runs mission critical applications like Mars Rovers, power plants, Public transport systems, etc. We should have a fair amount of rigour to ensure the software being written is rock solid, and taking shortcuts to learn basics of CS is bad.

[sgt101]

Artizans, not artists. But I agree with your point, failure to understand hashtables is like failure to understand the secret nail in carpentry (I choose this as I've never understood the secret nail in carpentry and therefore do not count myself much of a carpenter).

We shouldn't delude ourselves, software (at the moment) is a craft discipline and craft disciplines can have huge blind spots. Comp-sci needs to spend real effort on the hard to do questions like working out how to make systems usable and other corner cases which are ignored in favour of reams of papers about verifiability and modular composition; note I am not against this work, but I just don't think it should be funded while the experience of watching a six year old trying to use google or a mac is as humiliating (to a professional) as it currently is... and boy is it.

[FlyingSnake]

My bad, I misinterpreted your comment.

I second the artisanal mindset that you have elaborated, and it will be better for everyone if we adopt the craftmans mindset (Which Cal Newport also talks about). I personally feel that we should model Software Engineering like the Apprenticeship model in Germany. It would be interesting to see how it fares.

[ethbro]

I had someone reply to one of my comment that they 'didn't know about the Vietnam War because they weren't born then'.

... I feel like our discipline suffers from a lot of the same problems. IBM mainframe experience doesn't translate into knowing the intricacies of React, but it does provide wisdom on systems and usability problems people coding in React are going to run into too.

Glorify the new, but be informed by that which came before. Otherwise doom, repeating, etc.

[btschaegg]

Not that I'm disagreeing with you there, but I've also seen the opposite. I've had conversations with people who know their mainframe environment inside out but have no idea how a modern computer really works.

I'm under the impression that it often comes down to a combination of Dunning Kruger and a certain unwillingness to inform oneself about "new" things (i.e. things one doesn't know about yet) - and those seem to exist in both camps. So, just maintaining Aristotle's mindset and keeping an open mind seems like a good starting point to me in that regard.

[sgt101]

quite so.