Hacker News new | ask | show | jobs
by IanCal 3261 days ago
Some disjointed thoughts.

> we think we are recapitulating biology when in fact we are doing nothing of the sort (as these adversarial examples reveal beautifully).

I'm not sure I'd go so far. There's a pretty long list of optical illusions. Seeing motion where there clearly is none, not comparing distances correctly and most relevant here is things that look like a face. Here are a few selected famous examples: http://brainden.com/face-illusions.htm

Some of those immediately make my brain flag up "FACE". It's only looking in more detail that I see what else is there, but my visual system is clearly being tricked, as would billions of other completely independently grown visual systems. How much better could we do this, and with more subtlety, if we could analyse the whole brain like we can neural networks and target a specific brain?

There's an old experiment showing how a kitten raised never seeing horizontal lines will fail to see them ever after a certain age, so we know that biological systems struggle with limited visual input.

I'd also say we're doing matrix -> label conversions ourselves, too, unless we're born with a special geometric model. Deep learning also does things in layers, so there's not a direct matrix-label learning happening straight away, that should come much later after the system has learned to create a higher level representation of the input.

On a less contrarian side, I wonder how well these things would work if we were to show the networks videos of... everything. Years and years of video. Don't try and add labels yet, but can we add a constraint that we expect the representation to only change slowly? Two very similar frames should not result in the high-level interpretation changing drastically.

1 comments

I think we should refrain from saying we are recapitulating biology until we have reached the point where the machine systems tend to succeed AND fail in the SAME ways that the biological systems do.