[simon83]

Personally I don't mind at all that the refugees get this money. I'm glad they get some help, I just hope they make something out of it (which is not so easy in a rather unwelcoming society).

I keep hearing people say "they" take away "our" money, which is just a ridiculously tiny amount in the grand scheme of things. You never had the control where the money goes to to begin with. "Your" money could as well be spent to bail out yet another bank, or whatever useless for profit institution humanity has came up with.

[trampi]

Hi Simon, thank you for that reflected statement! May I ask you in which city you live?

I am a developer living in Munich. I started my first full time job in last november with 49k€ entry-level salary (Christmas bonus included). I have got a masters degree in computer science. My project lead (who has not studied) told me, that the requirement for having studied started being a thing in the last years - when he began, nobody asked for that.

[simon83]

I currently live in Stuttgart, which is apparently slightly less expensive than Munich. I don't think a 49k€ entry level salary for someone with a masters is good. It's probably enough to afford the basic necessities and a small apartment in Munich, but that's it. But then again, most companies seem to think this is good enough, it's so surreal.

I've been told many times in the past that a degree is not that important, what counts is experience. I haven't studied due to my laziness in my youth, but my experience looking for a job has shown me that a degree does matter. Some companies won't even invite you for an interview if you don't have a degree. I feel like I'd have a much better chance to negotiate a better salary with a masters or even bachelors degree.

[TurboHaskal]

49k is quite good. I know of engineers that started out with 35k. Masters with 40k.

[simon83]

That's exactly my point, these salary ranges are "normal" here. For the average developer with little responsibilities in life this may be more than enough. And so goes my theory, but please don't quote me on that: IT workers are undervalued because most of them only need a computer, internet access, a comfortable bed and fast food to live a happy life. And so they just accept whatever they are offered, because they don't need that much money. And why would you pay someone a lot of money to do something he/she loves doing anyway? We are being exploited in my opinion. CS is no simple stuff and not everyone is capable of working in that field.