[RandVal30141]

"I wish there were more definite sources detailing what the actual conflict is about. "

The death of Hamza Khateeb[1] comes to mind. Political and civil unrest was already underway, but the open violence against civilians including children sent Syria down a path. The government butchered that child among others caught for demonstrations or showing dissent.

"The attitude of the government against the people of Syria has not changed"

Laughable commentary in the face of regular chemical weapons attacks by the regime and it's paramilitary forces/Hezbollah allies.

This is a government that besieges and pummels civilian areas with indiscriminate weapons until they accept forced displacement under the 'reconciliation' campaign. To say it's attitude has not changed since before the protests is absurd.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Hamza_Ali_Al-Khateeb

[dang]

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14408068 and marked it off-topic.

[mpfundstein]

Why would the Syrian government torture and mutilate a 13-year-old boy and then return the body/proof to the parents?

Same with the current gas-bombs. What is the rationale behind this besides being pure evil? Assad made great progress in Syria and is pushing back ISIS and Al-Nusra. There was no strategical need for dropping gas but still, he apparently did... why would he?

Doesn't make sense to me...

[adsfqwop]

It doesn't make any sense, unless you realize that the deep state wants to destabilize Syria and dethrone Assad by force.

Then suddenly the narrative we're being offered starts making more sense. And I stress the word narrative, as in "story".

[mpfundstein]

Sorry for my ignorance but what is the 'deep state' . Never heard of it.

[adsfqwop]

Late reply. Not sure if you will see this, but think of it as the part of the government that doesn't change with the new administration. That is very much simplified, but gives you some idea.

You think some greenhorn administration comes in and says how things are done? No, the deep state makes the rules. They know the game, they have played it forever, they make the rules. What changes every four years is just a facade.

[euyyn]

> Why would the Syrian government torture and mutilate a 13-year-old boy and then return the body/proof to the parents?

The obvious possible motive is to send a signal that that's what happens if you oppose the regime. Your kid disappearing isn't as strong a message as receiving his corpse in pieces.

> There was no strategical need for dropping gas but still, he apparently did... why would he?

There was strategical need to drop bombs, even Assad and Putin acknowledged that. Why not gas? The lesson from the previous gas attack a few years ago, whether or not he did it, was that he could get away with it.

And there's been ethnical cleansing going on on both sides in that region. So it isn't the most surprising thing either.

[candiodari]

> The death of Hamza Khateeb

Ok, but how do you go from that to islamic state ? And frankly, how does a protest like that get organised in the first place by the locals ?

> regular chemical weapons attacks by the regime

Maybe I'm misinformed, but I seem to only recall that the government was accused of doing this once. This is neither regular, nor was it the cause of the conflict.

[matt4077]

Islamic state really doesn't have much to do with the conflict, except that there was suddenly a lot of territory in eastern Syria that the Syrian state could no longer defend, i. e. a power vacuum.

Northern Iraq was similarly weak, and there was a lot of frustration against the Iraqi government, plus many unemployed former members of Saddam Hussein's military with some experience.

So they thought "fuck it, lets start our own country. With blackflags and dead hookers". A bit like these sovereign citizens, but with better social media.

[boomboomsubban]

>Ok, but how do you go from that to islamic state ?

Through two years of civil war, causing unrest, instability, and dissatisfaction with both sides of the conflict. Add in the fighters who had been in the same situation for the past decade in neighboring Iraq, and you end up with a large group of armed people that want nothing to do with Russia or the US.

[kevin_thibedeau]

> Ok, but how do you go from that to islamic state ?

How did Trump win the election?

[gscott]

Collusion of the DNC and Hillary campaign to hurt Sanders, Hillary's not ever turning over her work emails when she was done at the State department, Clinton's universal college plan which would bankrupt the United States... and it goes on and on.

[pjc50]

Nobody seems to care what Trump does with his emails: https://thenextweb.com/politics/2017/01/26/trump-staffers-in...

More generally, he's been even more disastrous than people campaigning against him expected, up to the point of letting Russian intelligence wander around the Oval Office and take pictures.

[RandVal30141]

"accuse"

Not accused, found culpable by OPCW[1] along with ISIS. The chlorine attacks have been on-going, including the siege of Aleppo, on Hama and north Homs, and in the Damascus area. Method of delivery has been air dropped[2] or IRAM type.

" And frankly, how does a protest like that get organised in the first place by the locals"

I'm hoping this is not a joke. Local coordination committees[3] have long been involved in organizing demonstrations and media exposure. People voted on the weekly theme[4] for Friday protests even. When you see logos of Syrian media on CNN and other outlets it is often bearing the logos of these groups.

Yes, locals and organize protests among themselves and others in their nation.

[1] https://www.opcw.org/news/article/opcw-executive-council-ado...

[2] https://youtu.be/PiDntC_E0SY

[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local_Coordination_Committees_...

[4] http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/syria/8...

[ghvknvgvh]

You have an agenda dude.

[RandVal30141]

I helped disseminate numerous live feeds of demonstrations, ones people flippantly suggest locals were incapable of organizing, like this one from Houla Syria[1].

Months later a massacre[2] was committed there by government forces.

Yea, I have an agenda.

[1] http://bambuser.com/v/2394719

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Houla_massacre