[fefesafaea]

I read it. Maybe you should go to a store and actually get one of these cards, then let me know how it works out.

Seriously though, these cards, like many "financial products" come with a variety of price points and fee structures. If you re-read my comment, you'll see that I didn't claim my figures were definitive, but they are definitely in the ballpark.

[bpodgursky]

Um, no, you completely made up the numbers, making no attempt to source from the article which laid them out clearly. It's not the same "ballpark".

- It's $1 for the card, not "$5-$10"

- It's free cash withdrawal, not $3

- It's free deposits from direct deposit or government benefits, not $3

You are not approaching this remotely honestly.

[fefesafaea]

https://www.walmartmoneycard.com/account/legal-info-page?pro...

As I said, there are a variety of cards on offer, from a variety of sources, but they all seem to fall within the same range cost-wise, even if the fees are structured differently.

It's as if we are arguing about cars, and you want to debate whether the pinto in question had power-windows or not, while ignoring the fact that it will explode in a routine accident.

[bpodgursky]

Dude, you really need to think carefully about whether you are approaching this topic honestly, or if you are hunting for reasons to reinforce your belief that this card is a scam.

The precise things you claimed about this card are _not true_. Those are facts. If you want to debate, use _facts_.

Nobody is denying that WalMart _could_, if they wanted to, offer a savings card which is a scam. But also consider their motives going into this, compared to the average bank:

- Wal-Mart's goal is to get people to spend money at Wal Mart. This card makes it easy to spend money at Wal-Mart.

- Banks exist entirely from interest on saved money, and on fees.

Since these customers have very little saved money (the whole point of this article), the money made is entirely from fees, unless you have another reason to get people to use the card. Wal-Mart does -- it is totally reasonable for them to run this program at-cost to attract customers. You cannot say the same for any bank.

If you want to disagree with the merits of people spending money at Wal-Mart, that's a different topic. But the evidence points to this card being a good deal for an underserved part of the population.

[fefesafaea]

Not sure why you are accusing me of intellectual dishonesty, unless the goal is to derail the conversation.

You are right to say that a few of the specifics I gave were not correct. I was clearly not arguing that. However, the specifics you gave were not 100% correct either. For instance, if you go to an atm machine in a wal-mart and attempt to withdraw cash, you will be charged 3 dollars. The fee breakdown I linked bears this out. A fee breakdown, I might add, that is several pages removed from the main page describing the class of card in question.

[bpodgursky]

The FAQs (https://www.walmartmoneycard.com/account/faqs) say

> You can withdraw cash from your card at any Walmart register or MoneyCenter. This service is free for the Walmart MoneyCard product with Cash-Back Rewards.

Where are you looking?

[fefesafaea]

Alright, start on the page you just linked https://www.walmartmoneycard.com/account/faqs

now click on the fees tab https://www.walmartmoneycard.com/account/faqs#fees

then click on the 'fee plan' link https://www.walmartmoneycard.com/account/legal-info#feeplan

then click on the 'view the Wal-mart money card fee plan' link https://www.walmartmoneycard.com/account/legal-info#feeplan

and you will arrive at the fee plan I linked earlier.

[kefka]

I suppose you're in the wrong income bracket to have considered services from them.

Yes, they do charge fees at the register, regardless your link. When I went and deposited the $200 check from Wal-mart at a register, and $197 goes in... yeah. You can link URL's all you want. But 3$ disappeared in that transaction for "reasons".

I know because I've used the plans that people here are talking about. Unlike the rest of you, I've had them. I've used and been used by them.

[kefka]

You do realize you're talking to people who've never had to use these services, never made under $40K (except when living at home), and are many steps removed from ever having to go through this?

Yeah. I have. I did the Green Dot. Pile of shit, with hidden service fees, usage fees, loading fees, fee fees. Oh yeah, YC.

Ive been on food stamps. I've been on unemployment. Even been homeless for a time. Right now, I have a significantly better job... But I still live in a trailer.... err, "Tiny House".

But anyways, good luck explaining what you mean. These people don't get it, and their societal structure means that they won't get it, even if you linked the very documents to them. It's out of their worldview.

[Aloha]

I think another point to be made is the OP is correct - most non-bank alternatives are horrible, but so much of modern society is inaccessible if you do not have a bank account or bank account analog.

Also, to quote from the article.

"Check-cashing outfits, payday lenders, and similar businesses are often thought of as merely preying on poor people, who, the conventional wisdom goes, tend to make bad financial decisions. Lisa Servon, a University of Pennsylvania professor of city and regional planning, offers a different angle in her recent book, The Unbanking of America: How the New Middle Class Survives. During Servon’s research working as a teller at a check casher and payday lender, consumers told her that the fee structures of nonbank alternatives were more transparent and predictable than those at conventional banks—crucial to anyone living on a budget."

I understand where you're coming from, I was in the payday loan trap at one point.. robbing peter to pay paul as it were, I made much less than 40k a year, its only in the last 5 years I've started to get north of 50k, and gotten comfortable.. now I save save save..

[fefesafaea]

Hey thanks for the support. While I don't think making sweeping generalizations about HN readers is necessarily constructive, I would definitely agree some of us are working from very different assumptions here.

I guess the main thing I was attempting to communicate is that the facts on the ground are very different from the facts as presented in this article and elsewhere online. While it's definitely difficult to convey this in brief internet comments, I do feel there's a worthwhile discussion going on, so thanks to all involved as well as those reading. :)