[Diamons]

Enjoyed the read overall but one line stuck out: "- I take one bite out of my cold Big Mac and eat one cold fries and throw it all out."

You have to be a special kind of asshole to throw away meat and food instead of just saying the food is cold.

[linkregister]

You might not want to visit a farm, processing plant, warehouse, grocery store, or restaurant. They all throw away enormous amounts of food. Throwing away a Big Mac because it got too cold is a rounding error in perspective.

That said, we produce more food than we ever have. Is there a difference to starving people whether a grain of wheat went ungrown or was wasted?

What was the author meant to do, walk the hamburger and fries (with bites missing) to his closest homeless shelter?

[kakarot]

In kindergarten, I starred in a play that haunted me for years and years. My role was to explain the amount of food waste produced by America every year.

I wonder how it is today, but at the time it was on the order of half a billion tons a year.

Spent the rest of my childhood trying to be hyper-conscientious about the waste I produced.

Got to high school, got a job at a local restaurant, eventually moved onto large-scale corporate catering, and then went to live and work on a farm.

As I moved up the scale of food production I only saw more and more waste. It was sickening but at the same time completely understandable when you realize that there are diminishing returns. The larger your business is, the more waste becomes "not worth our time".

I just can't feel bad about throwing away half a pizza here and there anymore.

After I left the farm I took one more job in food service before moving to tech, and that was at a small-scale startup that produces healthy, fresh, TV dinner style foodstuff, and distributes them at retail locations.

I was blown away at how efficient the whole process was. One of the chief philosophies of my boss was conservation. With a business model that revolved around maintaining a supply of each meal reflective of its demand, and making dishes that could be built upon common base ingredients, we were able to exactly calculate the amount of food we needed to make each day. If for some reason there was a piece or two of chicken left, or some rice, an employee would just take it home. I just wish every place could be that committed to not wasting food, by creating a business model that incentivizes such behavior with a better profit margin.

Part of the issue with scale is that this extra profit margin becomes more and more marginal. Supporting local farms, co-ops, and cooks is probably the best thing we can do to enable less food waste across the industry.

[PacketPaul]

About 1/3 of the food in the US is wasted. And this is exactly what we want!

Food is a renewable yet spoilable resource. Easy to create, hard to store long term. Having more food then we need means the system has the capacity to absorb disruptions. If we consumed 100% of the food created, any disruption such as a cold spell in Florida would cause people to go hungry.

[pbhjpbhj]

Resources farmed is not the same as food produced. If you consumed all food produced but had stocks of farmed resources that could be used to make more food (wheat, sesame, beef, onions, say) then with excess capacity you could readily produce more food. Our supply chains are such that we can go from field to table in a day, that allows us to go field to freezer (or canning factory, or whatever) too.

This perhaps relies on non-capitalist management of food production however.

tl;dr I don't agree with your conclusion.

[betenoire]

My head agrees with you. My mom's voice in my head fills me with guilt.

[linkregister]

Mine too. I have the terrible habit of finishing all the food on my plate, even though 1/4 of it will be converted to fat/simple sugars. Our portions are much bigger than those our parents had.

[stephen_g]

Are you talking about in the US? Because they're much larger than most of the rest of the world too!

I was pretty amazed the first time I went - for McDonalds specifically, the US's medium size for drinks and fries is bigger than our large size in Australia! And we have no super-size or drink refills. (Our Burger King equivalent is about the only fast food chain I can think of that does free refills. It's very rare for restaurants in general here).

[maehwasu]

Time to free yourself from the moms.

[msie]

Well, I guess I should give up on recycling and get a gas-guzzling car because doing my share isn't going to make a difference. Maybe I should rob a bank because banks are being robbed everyday. The author could have saved it for later or heated it in a microwave because he spent good money for it.

[PhasmaFelis]

That still wouldn't make it useful. Most westerners consume far more calories than we need to survive. Eating beyond that is just for pleasure; from a purely practical standpoint, it's just as "wasted" as if you threw it away.

[stctgion]

Microwave it like the rest of us

[QuantumGravy]

No no no, you separate out the vegetation, if any, and keep it aside. Microwave any non-vegetable remainder for 15-30 seconds, depending on the mass of the burger: just enough to warm the meat. Transfer from microwave to toaster oven in two halves, toast briefly to crisp the buns, re-sizzle the meat, and melt the cheese. Arrange vegetation back in between. Enjoy a McDonald's burger that rivals its freshly served cousin. Finally, sit back and question the life decisions that lead you to putting this much thought into reheating fast food from McDonald's.

[linkregister]

What about the energy wasted to cook that food? There are freezing Inuit who could have used it.

[chillwaves]

It takes far more energy to create a big mac than to nuke one.

[pc86]

Microwaving fast food french fries is a special kind of alchemy that somehow turns them into concrete.

[baby]

I worked at McDonalds and we would throw burgers after X minutes if they didn't sell. Can't remember what X was but we were throwing a lot of . Same thing with fried stuff like mcnuggets except we would wait longer before throwing it. I don't know why we were following the rules for burgers but not for fried stuff... It all seemed like waste to me because X was pretty short. But this was to ensure good quality, crunchiness and all that jazz. Mind you that it was not a franchise and it was in France (where McDonalds restaurants have higher standards).

[greedo]

Used to be 10 minutes. Not sure now. Fried foods like McNuggets, McChicken and Filet O Fish were kept in a cabinet, then assembled into sandwiches. They were kept for roughly 30 min? The reason for the 10 minute rule was a quality issue; after that amount of time, cheese was gross, and the various condiments were trashed.

[pbhjpbhj]

How tightly do they manage their production rate, presumably they're more careful than just "keep 6 on the warmer" and more like "the usual rate at this time is 70 per hour, we only lose 15% of those sales by asking the customer to wait, 5% of those losses go for other products, so we'll make at a rate of 1 every X minutes unless we have more than Y on hand"? (numbers completely off the top of my head)

[upvotinglurker]

I worked at a franchised US Burger King in the late '90s. The shift manager would tell us how many fully assembled copies of each popular sandwich type to keep on hand. I never saw any charts or evidence of number crunching, but the numbers did vary based on expected traffic for the day of week and time of day, and the popularity of the specific item.

The sandwich wrappers had the numbers 1 to 12 printed on them, and you were supposed to mark the pre-made sandwiches to show when to throw them away. For example, if you assembled the sandwich at 12:15, mark the 5 to show that it should be thrown away when the clock's big hand is on the 5. Literacy not really required.

[greedo]

I worked back before they had installed microwave ovens, so the person in charge of coordinating the production rate had to be a good judge of the sales rate, the abilities of the grill team etc. We usually tried to time things so that we had the most food ready for lunch rush, and then let it tail off so that we didn't waste a huge amount. McDonalds had all sorts of little charts that averaged sales rates per hour, item rates within that hour etc, but a good employee running the "bin" was far better than someone who just used the charts.

[baby]

I was in a pretty busy McDonalds so we were usually asked to do one more of X when doing X, or two more of Y, or 5 more of Z, ... depending on the rush. That's how we ended up trashing some.

That's because, when doing a big mac for example, it's almost as easy to make one or five on a tray. So better make 5 if you're in a rush, they will likely be fulfilled.

In cool periods we would only produce on command. So no waste. Fresh burgers.

Everyone used to say that Franchise didn't care too much about these rules (where they should), and the director didn't like getting employees from Franchise McDonalds because they had to re-learn all the hygiene standards. Since that day I avoid franchise restaurants and go only to the official ones.

[greedo]

In my experience, franchise stores were generally better run than McOpCo stores. Many of the McOpCo stores were stepping stones for their mgmt staff so they didn't care about profits as much. They ran their stores by the book, but that didn't always correlate with a well run store. I used to be able to spot a McOpCo store within a few minutes of walking in.

[baby]

define better run? You mean from a business stand point? Sure. We would throw a lot of things, wash our hands all the time. From a hygienic/client point of view? I wouldn't agree.

[PhasmaFelis]

What do you think they'll do with it if you complain that it's cold? If you don't want it, it's getting tossed either way.

"Eat your peas, there are starving children in Africa" only makes sense if there's a ready means to get your peas to the starving children. If the choices are eating food you don't want or throwing it away, it's wasted either way. Eating it isn't the superior moral option; it doesn't accomplish anything but making you fat.

[gjm11]

Asshole? Why? What harm or pain did Ed cause to anyone by throwing the food away?

[logfromblammo]

The temperature of food can be easily changed with the ubiquitous household appliances called "refrigerator" and "microwave oven". And it isn't as though a drop in temperature of 5 degrees changes the flavor.

It's like throwing your pants away because you spilled ketchup on them, or throwing your car away because it ran out of gas--trivial issue, easily remedied.

Besides that, McDonald's corporate considers the service temperature of their food to be deadly serious. Complaining to the management with cold food and receipt in hand would almost certainly generate an overly obsequious response sufficient to satisfy even the grumpiest of customers. If not, going to management above the restaurant would probably get everyone at the restaurant re-trained right quick.

[ergothus]

> And it isn't as though a drop in temperature of 5 degrees changes the flavor.

Leaving aside the rest of the discussion, and not even addressing if throwing it out was good/fine, this line stood out to me.

I often feel that temperature changes the taste. More obvious in ranges > 5 degrees, but still noticeable at that range. Given how subjective taste is, it's hard to prove, though I'm sure some neurologist has hooked a pig or chimp up to try and measure the "taste" reaction. My two questions for you are:

* Do you feel temperature has no real (direct) effect on taste, or only in larger swings than 5 degrees

* Do you have any reason for your above statement than your own experiences? (not a criticism, curiousity)

[Retric]

It's well known that the current temperature changes the taste. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/19/temperature-can-eff...

But, I think his comment was changing the temperature is easy, and having food get cold does not change the taste after reheating. However, there is a large food safety issue with how long food stays between 40f and 140f, which is probably the root cause of this policy.

[dragonwriter]

> But, I think his comment was changing the temperature is easy, and having food get cold does not change the taste after reheating

This is as untrue as saying temperature doesn't affect flavor; cooling/reheating cycles affect flavor and texture of food.

[mod]

I don't agree with your assessment of the comment, it seems very clear that he thinks temperature does not affect the flavor.

Also, maybe I'm the only one, but I think (some) food tastes entirely different after a trip through the microwave.

Off-topic: How can HuffPo not know the difference between effect and affect?

[logfromblammo]

Correct. Flavor is an important component of taste and the eating experience. Temperature is a separate component. They are weakly linked, but with the temperature I envision for fresh McDonald's fries left on a tray for 15 minutes before serving the customer, there is no meaningful difference to me in flavor. The change in temperature is obvious, but as I don't value it much in my own eating experience, I have difficulty imagining its importance for others.

In my mouth, flavor is the dominant component. Temperature only matters if the food has fats or volatiles with a phase transition temperature between 25 and 40 degC. If food is too hot, I taste burning heat instead of flavor, and when it's too cold, the ice crystals numb my taste buds. But in between, my perception of the flavor is more affected by chemical composition than temperature. Room-temperature french fries are fine. You can chew them up without burning your mouth. Refrigerated fries aren't quite as good, because the fats solidify and the flavoring volatiles don't vaporize as readily. So pop them in the microwave, and they're good again.

[Retric]

Depends on how you use the microwave and moisture content. But, 5 minutes at 20% is significantly different than 1 minute at 100%.

[PhasmaFelis]

> The temperature of food can be easily changed with the ubiquitous household appliances called "refrigerator" and "microwave oven". And it isn't as though a drop in temperature of 5 degrees changes the flavor.

You ever eaten a microwaved hamburger? :)

[logfromblammo]

You know, that gives me an idea for a science fair project. Conduct a blind taste test for the same food prepared in different ways. I'm thinking hot dogs, though.

[msie]

Seems disrespectful to poor, starving people.

[linkregister]

1. 40% of food in the U.S. is discarded. https://www.nrdc.org/sites/default/files/wasted-food-IP.pdf

2. Much food is never harvested. A large portion of it is also never taken to market due to blemishes. http://californiawatch.org/health-and-welfare/food-waste-rem...

3. Supermarkets discard about 1/3 of their food due to spoilage, blemishes, and overripeness. http://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2014/09/25/351495274/sup...

[altcognito]

Food that doesn't make it for human consumption at the farm/factory level often finds its way as animal feed.

[msie]

I'm puzzled by your response. You list some stats about waste and that justifies what the guy is doing? Of course it's probably hyperbole but people are working hard to defend this guy's statement.

[apatters]

It seems like a growing number of comments on Hacker News are of this virtue signalling, amplify the problem but offer no solutions variety. This is not the hacker ethos.

The hacker looks at your parent and says woah -- grocers throw away 30% of food? There's a startup opportunity. And when they succeed they accomplish more than all the hand wringing in the world about someone else not doing their part.

[Banthum]

Multiplying together, only about 30% of the food grown is actually consumed?

Is that really true? Whoa if so.

Oddly enough, it kind of makes me feel better about food security.

[brianwawok]

I think even bigger is the 10:1 gains or more you lose feeding crops to animals. If we all went vegan we would almost instantly double our food supply.

Spoiler: I eat meat

[nicky0]

Is this low, high or average compared to other countries?

[slavik81]

It's fairly normal. In the first world, we waste a lot of food because consumers can afford to be picky or forgetful. In the third world, they waste a lot of food because storage and distribution infrastructure is worse.

[comboy]

With this kind of logic, flushing your toilet is disrespectful to people in Africa with limited access to drinkable water.

[msie]

Well, it is. So don't be wasting water unnecessarily. If you spent time and money eating at McDonald's why would you throw it away? Our society wastes a lot for sure so try not to. Don't go to McDonald's in the first place.

[csorrell]

We don't have a water shortage problem just like we don't have a food shortage problem. We have a water/food distribution problem. Throwing away a burger in the US takes nothing away from Africa.

[comboy]

If you bought this burger, you already gave back to society by paying for it. It has zero influence on the rest of the society whether it goes through your belly or not before being disposed.

[komali2]

Respectful sure, but I could argue I'm disrespectful to the world's poor every time I light a joint, kick back on my couch, pig out on taco Bell, and watch Vikings in my air conditioned condo.

[msie]

Not the same. You are not throwing out your Taco Bell after the first bite.

[komali2]

I disagree that it's not the same.

1. Whether or not I eat the food is irrelevant to the poor.

2. The amount of food I order is completely up to me. I usually order, and eat, more than I need to survive (because I'm stoned). I revel in the decadence and my ability to buy and eat so much food I'm disgustingly full. I could argue that I do this to "flaunt" my wealth and privilege.

(really, I do it because I grew up dirt poor and hungry, so I gain inordinate pleasure from excess. Probably unhealthy, but it's my birthday and I'll cry if I want to)

[seansoutpost]

This country (USA) throws away $537 Billion retail in food annually. I don't think it's just this guy.

[drakonandor]

Does trash really have a $ value? ;)

[mpeg]

As Dave Chapelle would put it; you can't do comparative suffering.

There might be people starving in Africa, but I still want my lunch.

[msie]

Do you take a bite out of your lunch and then throw it away? :D

[csorrell]

Would it make any difference to the hungry if he ate the whole thing? They'd still be hungry.

[pc86]

Only if you threw it away instead of giving it to a poor, starving person. Between two choice of eating it or throwing it out, neither affects the hungry any more than the other.

[aquadrop]

Is opening a window in a too hot room disrespectful to those who are freezing on the north pole?

[Mz]

The article indicates he tried to suggest to the employee that his fries should not be sitting on a tray getting cold while waiting for a burger and got ignored, nor should a burger be cold if you had to wait for it. I am not even convinced he was being literal. That reads to me as possible hyperbole to emphasize the point that he only goes when it has been so long that he has forgotten how bad it is.

Plus, see other remarks here about how 40% of food goes to waste for various reasons.

[csours]

Kinda OT, but that's why I never buy physically large food items at McD's: the quicker you eat it the warmer it is.

Also, the quicker you eat it, the less you have to think about it; and most of McD's food items do not bear much thinking about.

[freeflight]

Just customize your order in such a way that they have to make it fresh. I don't eat raw tomatoes, so if I tell them not to put those on my burger/wrap/whatever I end up getting freshly made food that's even hot.

[omegaham]

You can specifically ask for them to make it fresh; you just have to be willing to wait around for them to make it.

On a similar note, I hate the "exploit" of "Ask for fries with no salt to get them to make you a fresh batch of fries" when you can just ask them to make you a fresh batch of fries. Potatoes are about $6 per hundred pounds; they could not care less about making you a fresh batch if it means chucking the old fries out.

[jon-wood]

The other thing to hate about asking for fries with no salt is that making them has a fairly high chance of flinging hot oil on yourself. Usually the addition of salt causes the oil to soak in a bit, without the salt it doesn't soak in and gets thrown around the place.

[mpeg]

YMMV too.

Personally, in my local McDonald's I can put an order without talking to a human, pick it up and buy some weed on the way out.

Is that representative of every McD? No.

[pc86]

Other than the lack of human interaction I'm sure it's representative of a fair number of them.

[msie]

Wow, look at all the responses and downvotes. More privileged assholes with money to burn feel it's fine to spend $10 on a meal and just throw it away. Just because there is so must waste doesn't mean that you have to behave like you don't know the value of money.

[averagewall]

What things do you feel it's acceptable to throw away without being a privileged asshole? Is there a way you made this decision that can be generalized beyond Big Macs?

[douche]

Reminds me of the scene from the Into the Wild movie - McCandless is working in a McDonalds-alike fast food joint, and the camera lingers on a signs that says "It's O.K. to waste fries"

[ebbv]

What do you think they're going to do at a McDonald's if you say that? They're going to throw it away and make you a new one.

The reality is most of the food McDonald's serves nowadays is served cold. It's an unfortunate side effect of moving away from actually grilling meat to just warming it in trays.