[Velox]

I'm the original author for this post, and there are a few things I've realised since writing it (despite the fact that it was only 2 days ago).

The first is as allwein says below: Just because I made an assumption that source control is ubiquitous, it doesn't mean that it actually is, and it probably shouldn't be removed from the list.

The second is with regards to quiet working conditions. I've seen here, and on Reddit, that most people seem to vehemently disagree with me. I didn't imagine that there would be this level of disagreement. The popular opinion is that everyone should have quiet working conditions. My statement was that working conditions are tied to open office vs closed office, and it was a personal preference. So, my question to HN is: Am I wrong in thinking that this is a personal preference and that it benefits everyone to have private offices?

[delphinius81]

I think it should be revised to, "Do the office conditions satisfy YOUR needs?"

Some people like having lots of noise/people around them (all the noise blends together at some point) or they just put headphones on anyway so they don't care. Others want their own office, or could do a shared office. It's such a personal choice these days.

[kenferry]

This argument is no different when Joel first wrote the test, so to say the question is "out of date" isn't very accurate.

Furthermore, I would suggest that five years ago people were arguing about whether open plans were better. Seems to me like that argument is over, with the resolution being "nope, but they're cheaper!"

I personally often like to work in public areas. Having an office doesn't keep me from doing that, but it does let me retreat when I want to.

[ben_w]

I think private offices can be helpful, sometimes.

Anecdotal: At a previous job, I found a coworker quite furstrating, and he found me frustrating. The CTO told me the two of us were loud enough to be distracting the others, so I immediately tried to moderate myself… but the fact we were still aggravating each other was a contributing factor to me deciding to leave. I had enough respect for everyone else there that I was embarrassed to be noticeable in that way.

[rachbowyer]

Part of the way the Joel test works is to determine if companies value developers. Companies that will pay for developers to have their own offices are likely to treat them with respect. Companies that treat offices as status symbols and then deny them to developers are likely to treat developers with contempt.

The same applies to the "Do you use the best tools money can buy?" and "Do you have testers?" questions.

[wst_]

I am quite sure that noise level is a personal preference. I know people who use industry grade ear protectors (only few) and much more who just use headphones with loud music. Note that open office is not only about noise, though.

My answer would be - open office is the best, as long as you can have quiet time when you need to focus (headphones, protectors, whatever suits you.)

[jrs95]

From what I've read, it seems that open offices reduce productivity. The only real advantages I can think of are projecting coolness and saving money on office space.

[mynameishere]

Yes, you are wrong, if we are take the test for what it's worth--that is, Joel originally defined quiet as a value, and you have to assume that that's still correct. Otherwise, Joel doesn't know what he's talking about ("Noise is sometimes good!") so just drop the test completely.

Anyway, the baffling contemporary move towards open offices only increases the importance of the rule.

[mahyarm]

You can theoretically have quiet and open offices. Think of libraries and their quietness rules.