[itsoggy]

Originally when the vote was announced I was pro staying in, but like the above, the more I looked on to how the EU is run, how decisions are made, the more I didn't like it.

I have no issues with immigration, I'm all for people settling in whatever country the like!

I'm pro leaving the EU because I do not agree with how it is run and the direction it is heading.

[blibble]

I was very similar, I started out quite strongly in favour of remaining, did quite a lot of research and ended up firmly stuck on the fence, with my only reasons to stay being any to avoid taking any economic damage

[Angostura]

>I'm pro leaving the EU because I do not agree with how it is run

... such as?

[atmosx]

The EU is controlled by an informal body that doesn't exist on paper called the "Eurogroup". Decisions taken there, affect the entire continent. That group is tightly controlled by the German Finance Minister with his Hollander counterpart acting as a messenger. All other European Bodies hold literally no formal powers, while at the same time trying to somehow justify their existence.

I'd say that the UK would have a problem in the long run if the EU had any chance of reforming Brussels. I don't see how this can happen. The EU is disintegrating as we speak.

Regarding the anti-immigrant feeling of Britons. It's not just the UK. Greece has Nazis in parliament since 2010 or 2012 AFAIK. Anti-immigrant policies are enforced by socialist governments throughout Europe (Hollande, Merkel, etc.) as result of Brussel's austerity policy which led to a financial stagnation, but hey if it brings votes to the party. Far right parties already set the agenda in the EU, without being in power, because their positions are the ones that bring votes.

Picturing the EU as a nice place is misleading at best.

[Oletros]

> The EU is controlled by an informal body that doesn't exist on paper called the "Eurogroup"

http://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/council-eu/eurogroup/

> All other European Bodies hold literally no formal powers

What other bodies are you referring to?

[atmosx]

The European Council for example.

By does not exist on paper I am referring to the lack of transcript and formal responsibility about what can be said and done there.

[Angostura]

> All other European Bodies hold literally no formal powers

Except, of course that all the Eurogroup does is feed suggestions into the Council of Ministers, which literally holds the formal powers.

So, other than that - what do you have problems with?

[atmosx]

> Except, of course that all the Eurogroup does is feed suggestions into the Council of Ministers, which literally holds the formal powers.

Nope. That's what you might wanna believe. Finance Ministers are treated like total idiots - most of them are tbh. They have 10 minutes each to talk about the problems of their country and that's about it. While they are talking others are cheerfully blabbing about personal shit. After this happy exchange of opinions, the German FinMin passes a set of papers which other FinMins are forced to sign blindly, go home and say something along the lines "I know it sucks, but if we want to be part of the EU we need to sign this...". Every now and then the French and Italian FinMin try to express an alternative view but they get quickly spanked and sent home crying like babies.

You might find that acceptable. I don't. I am part of the majority apparently, so fasten your seatbelt 'cause the next couple of years we're going for a wild ride in Europe.

[Angostura]

Is this something in your head, or do you have evidence that any of this is true?

Because it sounds like you're inventing it as you go along.

[atmosx]

Yanis Varoufakis has talked extensively about it[1]. But the real evidence is the total lack of transcripts of a procedure that should be publicly available since it concerns European citizens directly. Since you seem to be so happy with the current state of the EU, could you explain to me why there is no transcript of what my FinMin said and what XYZ FinMin replied? Maybe you can enlight us.

[1] https://www.yanisvaroufakis.eu/2016/03/30/the-eurogroup-made...