[lotu]

The thing is in the US we lack a mandatory national or even state id. We use a driver's license which is effectively mandatory in rural parts of the country because otherwise you can't get anywhere. However if you are poor and live in a city the odds that you don't have a driver's license go way up. It turns out that their is no ID the government forces you to have. Clever politicians realize that they don't need to prevent everyone who disagrees with them from voting just preventing 2-3% is likely enough in many races.

The idea of voter ID is effective because of what you just said it sounds so reasonable, until you look at the motivation that it disproportionately results in poor people not being able to vote.

[Rapzid]

> The idea of voter ID is effective because of what you just said it sounds so reasonable..

This goes for more than just voter ID. Politicians will say things that "sound reasonable" or "are common sense" on the surface, but the motives and fact once you get into the details tell a much different story.

[oh_sigh]

Would you support voter ID if it came bundled with a low friction, easy to obtain voter ID card?

[vinay427]

Not the parent commenter, but I personally would support this if the ID card was mandatory and free to any resident citizen. If it was issued by states, the federal government would need to require all states to comply.

The REAL ID act was supposed to be a step toward this, but has been continually delayed as far as I know.

[tasty_freeze]

What problem do we have that a voter ID would solve?

[yehi]

Is that a rhetorical question? The reason given for requiring voter IDs (while possibly not the primary one) is to prevent voter fraud. Are you asking if there has every been a case of voter fraud? If so, here is one example [1].

[1] https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/oagnews/release.php?id=...

[jackvalentine]

I think the above poster is implying that voter fraud is so infrequent as to not be a problem.

I also note that mandatory ID laws wouldn't have stopped the case you linked - they had IDs but the fraudulent bit was the citizenship!

[yehi]

I'm not from the US but don't IDs require proof of citizenship? I mean, if an illegal immigrant were to try to get a driver license wouldn't they have to prove that they were legally in the US? Or can anyone from any country take a driving test and get a legal American drivers license?

If the later, then I can understand why people are against requiring such an arbitrary form of identification.

[cafard]

One can be a legal resident of the US, have a driver's license, and be unable to vote. I know a number of foreign nationals with licenses.

A bored immigration guy in Detroit once amused himself by pointing out that neither my driver's license nor my draft card showed that I was in fact a citizen of the US, or I guess a legal resident. When I said that this was the only ID I was carrying, and shrugged, he waved me through.

[dagw]

if an illegal immigrant were to try to get a driver license wouldn't they have to prove that they were legally in the US?

Varies from State to State as far as know. At least in some states it's enough to prove that you live in the state, not that you are living there legally.

[unprepare]

Youve linked an example of a woman who registered some non-citizens to vote which did not sway the election in her favor. I agree that non-citizens should not vote, but i do not agree with increased regulation from the government in order to fight against voter fraud which did not influence an election.

Can you link to a single instance of voter fraud effecting the outcome of an election?

[areyousure]

http://www.kansascity.com/news/local/article322208/Missouri-...

[unprepare]

I'll admit that I am surprised youve managed to find an election influenced by fraud, unfortunately the proposed solution of voter id laws dont seem to address this situation.

How would voter id laws prevent an american citizen from voting in a different district?

For example the texas election ID doesnt even include your address.[1]

[1]http://www.dps.texas.gov/DriverLicense/electionID.htm

[oh_sigh]

Can you link to a single instance of a voter affecting the outcome of an election?

[unprepare]

Yeah, i noticed this a couple hours ago, but after the edit time had expired.

[kalleboo]

Faith in the electoral system

[sanderjd]

I would have more faith in the electoral system if more people voted. This would result in fewer people voting.

[oh_sigh]

Why? If people don't want to vote, then they shouldn't vote. A person not voting because they know they are uninformed or don't care is great.

[sanderjd]

I disagree with you. That's fine though, I don't mind if you have that opinion, as long as it doesn't lead to disenfranchising people.

[js2]

Only if it is proven to prevent fraud and not to disenfranchise voters. Here's the thing: voting day fraud doesn't happen in any significantly meaningful amount. Voter ID's true motivation is to disenfranchise voters, and it's justified by claiming it prevents a threat which simply doesn't exist.

[burkaman]

Probably, but it would need to be extremely low friction. If poor people need to take a half day and go wait in line somewhere to get their new ID, that's not good enough.

[r_smart]

Do states not have a 'State ID'? I know we have them in the state I'm in. It's even easier to get than a driver's license and is used for all the same things except you obviously can't drive with it. They're also cheap.

[olejorgenb]

Uh, you guys have passports? (or am I overlooking something really simple?)

[fortenforge]

Nope. Only people who need to leave the country have passports. This generally doesn't apply to the working poor.

[burkaman]

~35% of Americans have passports. No reason to get one until you need to travel abroad.

[LordKano]

Passports exist here but not everyone has one. Off the top of my head, I'd say that most people don't have one.

[cafard]

I was in my 40s before I had one.